You Think You Don’t Kill Animals Because You Don’t Eat Meat? Wrong, Says Argentinian Naturalist

/, Food and Nutrition, Lifestyle/You Think You Don’t Kill Animals Because You Don’t Eat Meat? Wrong, Says Argentinian Naturalist

Among vegans and vegetarians, there are those who choose to do so simply because they prefer it – they do not like to eat meat.

And that’s perfectly fine. However, a lot more people who will say that they are on such a diet decided to stop eating meat for the love of animals, compassion, and in order to stop the killing.

This second group might be wrong and their reasoning is less logical. It may sound contradictory, to say the least, but not only that they participate in the killing of animals just like omnivores do, they might even harm animal life more than the meat eaters.

At least, that’s what claims Claudio Bertonatti, one of the most famous Argentinian naturalists, people who have dedicated their lives to nature. In his article “The vegan misconceptions” he warned the readers why by eating vegetables you still support the killing of animals. This drew the anger of thousands of vegans and vegetarians but also their colleagues who deal with environmental protection.

However, if you listen to his arguments carefully, you must admit that they make some sense.

“I was an ardent vegetarian. As a teenager, I grew up in connection and love for nature. I thought I could avoid killing many animals if I become a vegetarian. Later, I studied that topic a little better, I went into the wilderness and studied the local vegetable-animal world and then I changed my mind, ” explains Bertonatti in an interview for Playground.plus.

“I went to the country to study the wildlife. I realized that in the fields of wheat there are no birds, and those few that are found there are persecuted by farmers. As a vegetarian, I actually influenced the less killing of domestic animals, not the wild ones.”

“In Argentina, many think they are fighting for the animals if they do not eat meat or wear leather clothes. They think, if there were more vegetarians in the world, fewer animals will be killed. This is not true. From the moment humans began to cultivate cereals and work in the fields, it has already made an impact on nature and especially the wildlife.

There are no animal species that are not connected to the system, the survival of some depends on death, whether directly or indirectly. I understand that this knowledge can be painful. I’d like to live in an ideal world,” he explains.

“When I say this, many feel under attack. Rice, corn, pastry … most vegetarians eat it. The first impact of such foods production is the loss of forests. We are forcing nature to make room for crops. Many rainforests around the globe disappeared due to wheat and corn fields. And we continue destroying the nature by preventing the birds to feed. Many farmers use poisons against these birds.

For other animals, they put electric fences or scare them away with guns. So, if you eat meat, you participate in killing animals. But if you eat vegetables, again you participate in the killing of animals. But this time, you are helping in killing the wild animals,” says Bertonatti.

Should vegans abandon their diet because they can’t possibly cause zero animal deaths? From his PlayGround interview, it appears that renowned’ Argentine naturalist Claudio Bertonatti thinks they should.

Watch this really interesting video:

So what are your thoughts on this? Do Bertonatti’s statements make any sense to you?

I personally think he needs to do some more research!

References:

By Apollonas K.



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By | 2017-11-18T13:44:06+00:00 January 24th, 2017|Categories: Animals, Food and Nutrition, Lifestyle|Tags: , , , , , |861 Comments

861 Comments

  1. Farmer K Natural January 25, 2017 at 1:12 am - Reply

    A lot of that food production and deforestation is specifically to feed the animals that will feed humans. Why not just eat the crops and let those animals live? Grow your own food Mkay?

    • Sea Bass October 6, 2017 at 11:02 pm - Reply

      sorry – i didnt meant to reply to your specific post, i meant to just comment in general – to clarify, i totally agree with your comment! it’s spot on!

  2. Nathalie Felëus January 25, 2017 at 1:25 am - Reply

    Watch this and you understand that eating meat is even a way to save the earth 🙂

    https://www.ted.com/talks/allan_savory_how_to_green_the_world_s_deserts_and_reverse_climate_change

  3. Joanne Collinson January 25, 2017 at 2:05 am - Reply

    wrong……we grow tonnes more grain to feed the animals we eat so for those wild animals that may lose their habitat things would not change. less domestic animals would exist if we didn’t breed them for food freeing up thousands of acres of land.

  4. Ron Sharoni January 25, 2017 at 2:35 am - Reply

    Exactly like Carol says, no one thinking you can live without hurting anyone we are trying to minimize the impact and there is no question it will work.

  5. Carol Elizabeth Gough January 25, 2017 at 2:42 am - Reply

    His argument is invalid. His reasoning is faulty. The amount of forest razed to grow enough grain to feed factory farmed animals is many times more than what is required to feed a vegan populace. Water, fossil fuels, pesticide runoff are also 4-8 times greater than would be expended for vegan needs. 8 times as many fossil fuels, 4 times as much water, etc. are required to produce animal protein.

  6. Life Advancer January 25, 2017 at 8:47 am - Reply

    Hello everyone,

    I’m really sorry that so many people think we are trying to promote a specific idea or something. Our purpose is just to bring a topic for discussion and give some food for thought, that’s all.
    As the first lines of the article stated:

    “Among vegans and vegetarians, there are those who choose to do so simply because they prefer it – they do not like to eat meat.

    And that’s perfectly fine!!!!!!”

    We don’t have any kind of problem with vegans or meat eaters. Everyone is free to eat whatever he/she wants. Before you start to blame a whole website, please keep in mind that a specific article might just be the personal opinion of the author.

  7. Joel Feodiyoup January 25, 2017 at 6:04 am - Reply

    What are the cows fed? Grain. For years. To provide a few meals. If that grain is used to feed people instead of cows, then it feeds a lot more people. A vegetarian diet results in less death than a meat eating diet. Really, how can someone write an article about this and not have done the research to take into account that meat producers rely on massive volumes of grain to produce the meat, making the whole point of the article invalid?

    • Lyubomir Ivanov January 25, 2017 at 6:49 am - Reply

      You conveniently forget one important detail, however – animals utilize plant food better than humans. It is more efficient and environment-friendly to feed the grain to animals than to eat it directly. In exchange, animals give us more protein, more energy and more vital nutrients.

    • Malati Devi Dasi January 25, 2017 at 7:18 am - Reply

      Lyubomir Ivanov So 1 kg of beef is more nutitious than 25 – 50 kgs of grains needed to grow it? LOL!!!

    • Joel Feodiyoup January 25, 2017 at 11:10 am - Reply

      Lyubomir Ivanov I’m not an expert on how efficient different animals are at utilizing food. But think about this: for how many years was that cow fed grain until it reached the age where it could be slaughtered for human food? When you consume that meat, all those years of feeding the animal grain also was necessary. Even if the animal is slightly more efficient at utilizing the grain, it can’t compare to the alternative which is to just feed the grain directly to humans. All those years of grain go to feed humans, or we still farm all of that grain, except we just end up with one animal worth of food. They both use the same amount of grain, but the vegetarian option feeds far more people.

    • Miguel Sanchez January 31, 2017 at 6:39 am - Reply

      MH … This chart or meme or whatever it is is misleading in that the percentages are along different scales.

    • Miguel Sanchez January 31, 2017 at 6:43 am - Reply

      Here we go…

      My guess is that someone made this chart by combining data from a chart about vegetables and a chart about meat. Each of the two charts that got combined was true, but they were measuring protein content two different ways. The combined chart is wrong, because it shows the two different measurements like they’re the same thing, which they aren’t. The person who combined the two charts didn’t read them very carefully, or maybe found the charts without any information explaining them and didn’t realize they were different.

      The vegetables measure protein as a percentage of total calories.
      100 grams of spinach has 23 calories:
      .4 grams of fat (3.6 calories – fat is 9 calories per gram)
      1.9 grams of sugar (7.8 calories – sugar and protein are 4 calories per gram)
      2.9 grams of protein (11.6 calories)
      So of the 23 calories, 11.6 are from protein. That’s 50%, about what’s in the chart.

      The meats measure protein as a percentage of total weight.
      100 grams of chicken has 161 calories:
      9 grams of fat (81 calories)
      0 grams of carbohydrate (0 calories)
      20 grams of protein (80 calories)
      So of the 100 grams, 20 are from protein. That 20% is close to the 23% in the chart.

      To make a true chart that actually compared vegetables and meat, we would need to measure protein in vegetables and meats the same way.

      Both measurements by calories:
      Spinach: 11.6 calories out of 23 calories = 50% protein
      Chicken: 80 calories out of 161 calories = 50% protein

      Both measurements by weight:
      Spinach: 2.9 grams out of 100 = 3% protein
      Chicken: 20 grams out of 100 = 20% protein

      So spinach and chicken both give you about the same amount of protein per calorie, but there’s a lot fewer calories in spinach. As NJ mentioned, vegetables are mostly water. So you have to eat way more vegetables to get a specific amount of protein.

      You would need to eat 2 kilograms of spinach (4 pounds) a day to get all your daily protein from it. I would not enjoy that at all. 🙂

    • Joel Feodiyoup January 31, 2017 at 7:08 am - Reply

      Miguel Sanchez I rode a bicycle across Europe last year. I survived on loaves of bread and fruit/vegetables, and pasta. I didn’t eat any meat. I crossed the alps twice. By the end I felt very strong. Better than at the beginning. How did I get enough protein, given that I paid no attention to protein intake (or any nutrients)? I don’t say that to brag. Others have completed more impressive cycling trips. But I don’t understand how people can say that vegetarians/vegans must struggle to get enough protein, given that there are plenty of vegetarians/vegans doing perfectly alright. Did you know that too much protein has been linked to cancer? But supermarkets sell foods artificially crammed with huge quantities of protein.

    • Teri White January 31, 2017 at 9:25 am - Reply

      Malati Devi Dasi Grain isn’t very good for us, turns out.

    • Georgi Ivanov January 31, 2017 at 10:19 pm - Reply

      Are you taking to account the fuc*ing land that we need to feed 7 billion of people AND much more animals? Much smarter people than you and me thought of this idea already, but why isn’t it implemented yet, because you are going to either starve humans or either starve animals. Just think of it. Around 37% of the world’s land was considered agricultural land. “Christian Peters informs us that “a person following a low-fat vegetarian diet, for example, will need less than half (0.44) an acre per person per year to produce their food”

      “Surprisingly, however, a vegetarian diet is not necessarily the most efficient in terms of land use” he continues

      The reason is simple – fruits, vegetables, and grains must be grown on high-quality arable cropland. Livestock based foods (such as meat and dairy products from ruminant animals) are supported by lower quality, and far more widely available, lands that are only capable of supporting pastures.

      So, based on the last set of global census data (2008) we would require 3,068,444,911 acres of arable land. At that time, the global population was 6 billion and if a global one-child program had been enacted, the ~3,212,369,959 of arable land that was globally available may very well have sufficed.

      Not including the figures for degraded land, Earth is currently losing, due to a range of factors, arable land at the conservative rate of 1% a year. Thus, a more accurate current figure is far closer to that of 3,024,382,549 acres.

      However … we now have a global population that has already crossed the 7,000,000,000 mark, thus the number of arable acres required is far closer to 3,080,000,000 – or put another way, Earth now has a shortfall of ~55,617,451 acres … and rising. In short, we have passed “peak land” and our growing population requires far more arable land than we currently have available to provide the nutrition required for all of those people in a vegan form.

      As iterated, livestock is supported by lower quality (but far more widely available) land that can support pasture and hay. Thus, any claim that presumes we could simply remove the livestock and start growing vegetable or crop-based foods on the existing farm land is flawed.”

    • Cyd Pom Pom February 1, 2017 at 11:46 am - Reply

      Lyubomir Ivanov You really believe that? You just made that up. It does not even stand up to casual acknowledgement let alone scrutiny. If you r point was the case we could be able to magicly double the calories available by passing them through a cow. Twerp!

  8. Thanasis Athanasakos January 25, 2017 at 1:20 pm - Reply

    I think we still have democracy, so everyone is free to eat whatever he wants! Also everyone is free to think and say his opinion, some of you are overreacting to this article!

  9. Rachel Gerstner January 25, 2017 at 1:59 pm - Reply

    Here we go again with this nonsense from an obvious meat eater and not a vegan. Bought and paid by the meat industry, enjoy your propaganda folks. We all know that most of these farms are used for animal agriculture. Stop with the bs.

    • Dane Maxwell January 26, 2017 at 7:05 am - Reply

      Rachael I agree with you 100% This article is absolute nonsense and 100% Fodder/Shite!

  10. Akshay Junghare January 25, 2017 at 2:09 pm - Reply

    This argument is only partially correct. For growing meat & other nonveg lots of vegetarian food is consumed which could be directly consumed by people also. Only these creatures are grown for our sake. Dosen’t that harm the ecosystem?

  11. Paul Grocock January 30, 2017 at 1:23 am - Reply

    Rubbish, eating game and wild animals maybe. But domestic animals consume vast volumes of grown plant food just to produce meat.

  12. Dave Burgess January 30, 2017 at 7:12 am - Reply

    Twisted logic from a moron

  13. Stella Rios Shehi January 30, 2017 at 10:51 am - Reply

    Are you kidding me with this article? Our planet loses acres and acres of rainforest daily to create grazing pastures for cows!

  14. Christopher Pacheco January 30, 2017 at 10:52 am - Reply

    Your logic is flawed. The grains grown to feed animals are exponentially more than what humans consume. If you eat factory farmed meat, that meat has consumed 10x the energy (through grains). So if grains are the problem your doing exponentially more damage and consuming far more grains by eating meat. This is a stupid article and I’m not even a vegan.

  15. Kim Jackson January 30, 2017 at 1:11 pm - Reply

    I do understand this concept. However, the one fact this author neglects to mention is the majority of land that has caused deforestation is actually used to grow feed for animals and is not for human consumption…it’s a fact.

  16. Carol Schwers January 30, 2017 at 2:55 pm - Reply

    This is so flawed. You do not destroy the rainforest to make room for agricultural crops. Crop farming uses a fraction of land that animal factory farming does. This guy is an idiot. It’s animal agriculture that uses up all the land and pollutes the atmosphere, lakes, rivers and streams with animal waste and gases.

  17. At Mar January 30, 2017 at 3:49 pm - Reply

    He is just saying that becoming a vegetarian doesn’t mean it will stop killing animals completely. That’s all, if you are vegetarian you are still contributing, don’t worry…

  18. Colin Phillips January 30, 2017 at 4:25 pm - Reply

    I am not a vegetarian or a vegan ..I have no problem with people who want to be for whatever reason …but anyone will know that to grow any vegetable matter in your back yard or in a field you have to feed ..the food is either organic waste or chemicals ..right?

    Already vast swathes of land across America and the rest of the world have turned into dust bowles making the earth baron because of continuous use of chemical fertilizers…. this doesn’t happen if you use organic waste. muck from animal farms is spread every year ..at least here in Britain. But still, too many chemicals are used to deal with the amount of growth. So many by-products of an animal is used daily from soap and washing and cleaning materials ..pet foods etc ..I don’t want vast chemical plants vomiting out waste into the atmosphere either ..seems that the problem might be just too many people on the planet and we need to eat much less ,meat and create less waste in our homes .

  19. Ross Quinn January 30, 2017 at 4:47 pm - Reply

    Vertical Farming… problem solved, no need to kill anything.

  20. Carol Elizabeth Gough January 30, 2017 at 4:53 pm - Reply

    If the articles are posted to encourage discussion, they have succeeded. Is that not what we’re doing? Why are people getting so upset? We are all entitled to our opinions, however misguided they may be. I think I was prompted to comment mostly because I was disappointed that a fellow Argentine could be so close-minded. Also, the headline was very confrontational.

  21. Arreesh Rajan January 30, 2017 at 5:03 pm - Reply

    For all the vegans who justify by saying they don’t like to kill animal.

    • Nikitha Sathi January 30, 2017 at 5:19 pm - Reply

      Although a vegan diet does not completely prevent harm to animals, it’s at least less harmful than a non-vegetarian diet and that’s the point they’re trying to make, I think.

    • Pragadish Kirubakaran January 30, 2017 at 5:51 pm - Reply

      It’s not the most scientific of studies, true. But don’t be a kill joy, niggi.

  22. Clive Walsh January 30, 2017 at 3:08 pm - Reply

    The key is to try and live a more self sufficient lifestyle.

  23. Johnny Goldenberg January 30, 2017 at 3:08 pm - Reply

    Give me a call when the shuttle lands Claudio

  24. Anne-Marie Bevan January 30, 2017 at 3:09 pm - Reply

    Who said vegans think they don’t kill animals? They just try their best not to add to the unnecessary abuse and to avoid, to the best of their ability, killing animals. On the other hand, most vegans are not disillusioned to the fact that to live, something has to die, be it plants, or unfortunately somewhere along the line, animals.

    • Kelly Marie Ireland January 30, 2017 at 3:11 pm - Reply

      THANK YOU.

    • Nikki J Nichole January 30, 2017 at 3:16 pm - Reply

      Lol right?!? My goodness… Do they believe I will run out and eat meat now that I’ve read this? Um no! It’s unhealthy and full of hormones and chemicals. Not to mention… It’s someones baby ❤

    • Madge Higgins January 30, 2017 at 3:18 pm - Reply

      Yes, I m just doing my part to not, be involved with the cruel slaughtering houses!!

    • Jess Gaudette January 30, 2017 at 3:41 pm - Reply

      yeah just one flaw in your brilliant logic
      plants->regrow
      animals-> have eyes, feel pain, have a central nervous system.

      go pick a flower and then go stab a dog and lemme know if it’s still ‘all the same’ lol

    • Jess Gaudette January 30, 2017 at 3:54 pm - Reply

      hm I meant it metaphorically but totally see your point.
      violence isn’t ok in any scenario, I was just taken aback by how someone could compare a plant with a living creature and got heated. (not to say I don’t love my plants of course)

    • Kevin Harris January 30, 2017 at 4:38 pm - Reply

      It’s not possible to live without impacting the environment. Vegetarians and vegans just generally choose a lifestyle that has the smallest impact possible.

    • Hannah Duttera January 30, 2017 at 4:45 pm - Reply

      It’s the supply and demand part of economics, right? Fewer people eat meat, leading to less demand for meat, leading to fewer animals being mass-slaughtered. At least that’s what the guy I’m seeing says. He’s vegetarian so he explained this to me. I eat meat so I mostly figured that if the animals are already dead, why let them go to waste? But that probably just adds to the problem. So breakfast today is a meatless salad

    • Callum Ward January 30, 2017 at 5:12 pm - Reply

      Sustainability? Well what would you say when i say you can live a better healthier life and not eat meat? Is that sustainable enough for you? Silly silly comment

    • Jordan Gifford January 30, 2017 at 5:41 pm - Reply

      All these people saying plants don’t feel and aren’t aware or alive are fucking legit moron’s. Plants respond to a wide range of emotions and physical contact. Fucking science y’all. Just cause you don’t understand their consciousness doesn’t mean they are mindless things that are just there for consuming. You make it out to be superior to eat plants cause it isn’t killing something that’s alive, when in fact a plant is more alive then you could comprehend. Most of you should get your facts straight before coming to a pin point conclusion on how things work.

    • Uros Pajovic January 30, 2017 at 5:46 pm - Reply

      Nikki J Nichole Carson The same can be said for the plants you eat. If it comes from your garden or your pen, or some certainly safe source, then it’s healthy and without any chemicals or hormones. Most meat is healthy in normal amounts, excluding red meat. Overdose of anything can hurt or kill us.

    • Maeve McCluskey January 30, 2017 at 5:48 pm - Reply

      Do plants look like this!

    • Callum Ward January 30, 2017 at 5:48 pm - Reply

      Plants are setient we all know that, but i would rather eat the plant , than eat the cow which man had to destroy plant life to put there and also feed the cow plant life which to then have the cow produce enough green house gases to slowly destroy the world,its pretty simple really cause as little damage as possible,thats a fact too

    • Jordan Gifford January 30, 2017 at 5:54 pm - Reply

      Hester Grove please STFU. If you knew anything about grasses you would know that there is a lot of food that come from grasses. I hate when non well informed citizens try to make someone else seem stupid out of anger. Do some research on grasses Hester!

    • Jordan Gifford January 30, 2017 at 6:05 pm - Reply

      Maeve come on now. We all know what plants look like. Did you mean to say does a plant go through the same abuse as this animal??

    • Jordan Gifford January 30, 2017 at 6:10 pm - Reply

      Bro callum come on man! We all know what we use to farm your plants and veggies. And those machines also cause pollution and global warming on a mass scale. Your car you drive everyday is destroying the world. Just cause you pick a lesser evil doesn’t mean you’re saving the world. That’s a fact.

    • Callum Ward January 30, 2017 at 6:31 pm - Reply

      Who said i was saving the world? Im causing as little damage as possible as i previously stated And the machines used to farm my veggies are a minute fraction compared to how much methane your cows produce

    • Patricia Pauline Roe January 30, 2017 at 6:32 pm - Reply

      Just try their best. How does that change anything?

    • Callum Ward January 30, 2017 at 6:33 pm - Reply

      23 times less to be precise

    • Patricia Pauline Roe January 30, 2017 at 6:43 pm - Reply

      Your veggies or your grains? Because they are not even remotely comparable in terms of environmental impact.

    • Jess Gaudette January 30, 2017 at 7:31 pm - Reply

      animal agriculture-> 24% of greenhouse gas emissions

      all forms of transportation combined-> 13%

      changing regular practices of both would of course be ideal, but one is a much more simple lifestyle change

    • Maeve McCluskey January 30, 2017 at 7:47 pm - Reply

      Jordan Gifford obviously we all know what plants look like! But do they bleed? Or shriek in pain when they are cut open? Do they mourn the loss of a baby? Do vegans cause less suffering than omnivorous? Which would you honestly prefer to live life knowing you’re hurting a living, breathing vertebrae that forms social bonds with members of its own species and even other species, very much like ourselves or to eat a plant! Not everyone understands it but the vegans do ❤️

    • Lacey Heart January 30, 2017 at 7:55 pm - Reply

      Some People just want to make excuses for eating meat.

    • Jordan Gifford January 30, 2017 at 9:21 pm - Reply

      Collum your argument clearly states that you rather eat a plant instead of a cow. Solely on the basis of it not producing green house gases that destroy the world. Which in turn is you trying to save the planet. Wake the fuck up bro. Your car does damage to the planet. Your lights being on. You watching TV. When you charge your phone. Basing your food off the believe it’s doing good for the planet/environment is the last thing you should be complaining about. And I’m not even going to get into the sustainability thing cause I could go off for days on some real shit.

    • Jordan Gifford January 30, 2017 at 9:30 pm - Reply

      Maeve seriously? Your response is because the plants cant outwardly express itself emotionally it should be treated differently than an animal. Wow. Biased much? And just cause you have no clue about plants and how they are alive in their own way, doesn’t make it right or OK to say killing this organism is worse than killing the other.

    • Callum Ward January 30, 2017 at 9:45 pm - Reply

      What part of do as little damage as possible did you not fathom?

    • Linda Skrgatic January 31, 2017 at 12:05 am - Reply

      Awesome comment Anne-Marie very true

    • Amber Watters January 31, 2017 at 4:46 am - Reply

      Jordan Gifford yes! Many studies have shown plants reacting to emotions. Like a study put with terminally I’ll patients. They raised the plants from seedlings, and as the patient got weaker and closer to death the aura of the plants demolished. Especially upon death of the patient, they also showed plants only reacting to certain types of music. No rhym or reason for the particular genre each plant flourished with, they just did. Plants have “male” and “female” , plants have an aura that can be photographed just as any other living thing.

    • Jeff Birgbauer January 31, 2017 at 5:24 am - Reply

      Doubt most think this

    • Ila Cooper January 31, 2017 at 6:30 am - Reply

      Thank you Anne-Marie Bevan much more intelligent and educated answer. I’m not vegan although I’ve been leaning toward it more over the past couple of years. Strictly based on how horribly our food animals are treated and dispatched. I appreciate your reply here.

    • Matthew Davis January 31, 2017 at 10:25 am - Reply

      I’m hearing you. It’s not hard to live the vegan lifestyle, either. I’ve been vegan for almost 2 years, and I’m physically fine.

    • Vanyel Herzig January 31, 2017 at 1:05 pm - Reply

      Vegans think they don’t kill animals and they assume that because they aren’t eating meat, they aren’t adding to the suffering of animals. But they are. To live is to take the life of something else. There’s nothing you can do to escape that, your existence is using up something else’s resources and life. Is that a bad thing? Only if you don’t take advantage of it to do the best you can be, because your body will eventually be given back to sustain lives.

    • Sean Daws January 31, 2017 at 7:06 pm - Reply

      As far as I know no reputable study has ever shown that plants can “feel pain”. They lack the nervous system and brain necessary for this to happen. A plant can respond to stimuli, for example by turning towards the light or closing over a fly, but that is not the same thing. It is also hard to see what purpose pain could serve for the plant, since they can hardly run away. I am aware however that similar arguments were put up in the past in favour of animals not feeling pain! Supposing you decide that it is cruel to eat plants, since they are alive and presumably have sensations of some sort, what are you going to eat? Not a lot left on the menu if meat, and veg are removed, is there? If it is alright so long as you “kill” them first, how is this to be done? Is boiling them alive acceptable? Perhaps it is alright to eat fruit, since the plant sheds these of its own accord, but seeds and nuts are out as they are embryos !
      Susan Deal, Sheffield, UK

      Plants have automatic reflexes. To compare it to animals nervous system and to invalidate the animals we murder would be a shitty thing to do. Go and pick an apple, simple right

      Now go slit the throat of a cow.. not as easy unless you are missing some vital parts in your mind. Please make the connection.
      People love to lie so they can rationalize killing.

    • Tannia Meeth February 1, 2017 at 1:26 am - Reply

      The justification for confining, torturing, mutilating and killing other living, feeling beings debunked in 1 min. Non-vegans: please stop making excuses and go VEGAN. ✌️http://bit.ly/2hZrqmH

    • Harwill Diemling February 1, 2017 at 8:29 am - Reply

      Maurice Antoine There are two paths.

      One condones animal abuse, environmental destruction, species extinction, rainforest destruction. Violence and health problems and rising sea levels.

      The other does not.

  25. Lisa Ann Hillier January 30, 2017 at 3:09 pm - Reply

    i am not vegetarian to save animals. I am vegetarian because i don’t like to eat animals..big difference.

  26. Vera Catti January 30, 2017 at 3:10 pm - Reply

    Wow, this author has no idea that most crops provide food for farm animals.

    • Michael Scott January 30, 2017 at 3:16 pm - Reply

      Farm animals we kill to eat so if there was no plants no killing of them animals

    • Vera Catti January 30, 2017 at 3:18 pm - Reply

      The opposite, if we didn’t eat animals, they wouldn’t be breeded in so a huge amount and so there wouldn’t be the deforestation to grow the crops to feed them. And there is also the deforestation to host the intensive farmings.

    • Phor S. Aken Whan January 30, 2017 at 3:18 pm - Reply

      Bread, pasta, flour, rice, sugar, sunflowers, canola….are you sure most crops provide food for “farm animals”?

    • Vera Catti January 30, 2017 at 3:21 pm - Reply

      Yes… farm animals like pigs and cows eat a lot more than humans.

  27. Sandra Lee January 30, 2017 at 3:10 pm - Reply

    Then there should be population control which is never discussed. We have taxed the planet into a bleak future. Wait till the methane burbs in the siberian ice shelf – we will boil to death in a month or two. All planets and animals will die except those rich enough to buy bunkers in New Zealand.

    • Mocha Cierra Coy January 31, 2017 at 1:27 am - Reply

      ^that depends on quality of life expected. Ie, home size, eating habits, minimalistic degree of lifestyle in general. Theres rumors the rothschilds could shelter, feed, and clothe every human on this planet 3 times over. Its a matter of living alongside nature. In our current state, hell no. No one should have more than 4 kids. But, if we all lived all natural, in smarter homes….maybe not such a big problem

  28. Jeff Smith January 30, 2017 at 3:10 pm - Reply

    This is silly. Animals are going to do either way. If a vegan or vegetarian want to eat vegetables fine, maybe they feel like they are not directly responsible for that particular animals death.

    • Chris Cano January 30, 2017 at 3:24 pm - Reply

      Foreal, they just wipe their hands clean like Pontius Pilate.

    • Lisa Jackson January 30, 2017 at 3:32 pm - Reply

      Excuse me, can you please explain how by not eating animals, I only “feel like” I am not directly responsible for a particular animal’s death? When I don’t ever use animal products, I don’t see how you think I’m still somehow responsible for pigs dying? Being vegan, for me, is I doing what I can. Just because I can’t do it all, doesn’t mean I won’t do something. And being vegan is a pretty huge something. Don’t knock it til you’ve tried it.

    • Jeff Smith January 30, 2017 at 3:34 pm - Reply

      Lisa Jackson I was not ‘knocking’ anything. It seems to me that you didn’t read the article or you would understand my comment.

  29. Kim Nguyen January 30, 2017 at 3:11 pm - Reply

    I think the bigger issue here is the way animals and plants are raised. Eating meat is okay if the animals are raised in a humane way. He has a point, destroying the earth to grow plants isn’t right either. Plants also need to be grown in a way that is respectful to the earth.

    • Andreas Fürst January 30, 2017 at 3:30 pm - Reply

      there is no humane way in killing animals or humans i guess

    • Kim Nguyen January 30, 2017 at 4:25 pm - Reply

      It’s a hard subject. I mean animals kill other animals to eat them, but I see where you are coming from.

  30. Drois Conscious Phoenix January 30, 2017 at 3:12 pm - Reply

    another excuses for holocaust…. human race in herbivore get over it!!!! and the killing of bird and wild animals in crops is becos farmers is uneducated and no vegans ….

  31. Samuel Clough January 30, 2017 at 3:12 pm - Reply

    Omnivore all day everyday.

  32. Ionvs Stoubv January 30, 2017 at 3:13 pm - Reply

    Am I wrong by saying we need more crop etc for feedIng to animals than we would need to feed us plant based? So at all still more dead animals by eating meat, no?

    • Ionut Petrehus January 30, 2017 at 3:40 pm - Reply

      modern agriculture is killing the land and the bees in some countries. Don’t be a hypocrite see both sides of the story. The only way not to kill animals if you’re e vegan is growing your own vegetables and eat only what you are growing, but good luck with implementing this mentality on the entire humanity, when the majority of humans have no respect for their bodies and souls. On top of this humans lack the knowledge and time to do this. So yeah, I’ll repeat myself… don’t be a hypocrite

    • Ionvs Stoubv January 30, 2017 at 4:22 pm - Reply

      I try bro, you’re right.

    • Craig Hollingsworth January 30, 2017 at 4:25 pm - Reply

      No, you’re not wrong.

    • Haileigh Garoutte January 30, 2017 at 4:30 pm - Reply

      That is right. An omni doet requires far more vegetables and water and power than simply eating the vegetables themselves.

    • Andy Bickley January 30, 2017 at 6:07 pm - Reply

      You are right Ionvs, but you will never convince those who don’t want to hear it. Like with cigarettes companies the meat industry only have to disseminate enough miss information to make people think ‘I don’t know what to believe’ and so people will carry on eating what they most enjoy.

    • Chantelle Blanchett January 31, 2017 at 12:29 pm - Reply

      No, because some of the land cattle lives on isnt able to crow crops due to the soil (so the cattle is given hay bales etc) and then forest is destroyed to make ro for fields that can grow the vegies we need

    • Tannia Meeth February 1, 2017 at 1:33 am - Reply

      If you care about your health, the environment OR animals, please check out these life-changing documentaries. Thanks for caring! http://bit.ly/2gusC4A

  33. Lizzy Harvey January 30, 2017 at 3:14 pm - Reply

    Don’t wear them lol

  34. Jessica Stoppel January 30, 2017 at 3:15 pm - Reply

    I think this so called naturalist should spend a few hours in a factory farm or slaterhouse- better yet watch earthlings… nothing natural or humane about how we abuse, torture and enslave all animals in horrifying conditions. I would rather have all those animals killed then live through a lifetime of abuse and exploitation. It’s about compassion to their lives and conditions, not merely killing animals.

  35. Stuart Harrold January 30, 2017 at 3:15 pm - Reply

    Heres a simpler explanation. Vegetarians should not eat organic vegetables or fruit as organic fertilizer is made from mainly animal products.

  36. Dav Ids January 30, 2017 at 3:15 pm - Reply

    Interesting…

  37. Vladimir Sterpu January 30, 2017 at 3:16 pm - Reply

    Meat is the best 🙂

  38. Susanne Hilyard January 30, 2017 at 3:17 pm - Reply

    Why not just scroll on by for those who don’t like this instead of spewing out so much negativity…seriously

    • Sergei Tok January 30, 2017 at 3:30 pm - Reply

      Well.. It makes me just think. Why is this group posting this bs. Why bs? Livestock feeds on grain. All the point of this article disproved in 1 sentence. And btw, it’s called feedback. 🙂 have a nice day.

    • Liz Oldach January 30, 2017 at 3:38 pm - Reply

      It’s illogical information, that’s why people speak up. If the argument fails, why allow it to be cemented as fact?

      20-26 people could be fed on the same amount of feed that is grown for cattle. There are estimates that 8 billion people could be fed right now, a plant-based diet if the meat industry were to go away. We don’t quite have 8 billion people but the evidence is against this guy.

      Yeah, going to say something in opposition when there is evidence or logic to refute it.

  39. David Taborda Correa January 30, 2017 at 3:18 pm - Reply

    This point of view is kind of shit. The amount of “killed wildlife” against the number of thousands killed animals on Animal slaughterhouses is incredible ridiculous, it doesn’t make sense to compare them. Also vegan and vegetarians are helping with climate change, do the meat eaters do the same?.. i’m not agree with his point of view.. go a keep drinking mate viejoooo !

    • Vanessa Vieira January 30, 2017 at 3:29 pm - Reply

      The amount of animals killed because of large scale crop cultivation machines and poison from those crops is just as high. Insects count in this mix as they are animals.

    • David Taborda Correa January 30, 2017 at 4:11 pm - Reply

      well, in term of numbers, you will never end with insect population as they born in exponencial way.. and if you give me to choose between killing insects or cows for decrease the climate change i rather kill insects that are not in the world main diets.. probably frogs can make a demonstration lol

    • Amanly Load January 30, 2017 at 4:14 pm - Reply

      you also have to take in account of the natural balance that the earth maintains, if something gets out of hand, she corrects it, ie predators or a sissy fit which she will have if we dont stop heading away from god and nature.

      i mean god as the standard morals of the heart in its original natural state and universal consciousness.

      david could not have said it any better. Anythingelse is just splitting hairs.

      go local, go organic. spread your wealth between yourselves and stop giving it away to hoarders at the top without a true heart.

      Find wealth in other things and read the china study

    • Cameron Tauri January 30, 2017 at 5:00 pm - Reply

      Elegost Dale most likely they would be culled so there would be more land to grow plants, everyone knows you need to eat a hell of alot more plants to stay full than meat

    • Jordan Gifford January 30, 2017 at 6:30 pm - Reply

      David you’re some kind of stupid. Vegans and vegetarians are helping with climate change? Man gtfoh. You think the machines harvesting all the plant based foods run on air?

    • Patricia Pauline Roe January 30, 2017 at 6:37 pm - Reply

      Unless vegans stop eating grains they are contributing heavily to loss of diversity and the wildlife ecology. If vegans want to be helpful they need to stick with vegetables.

    • Lina Mukovozova January 30, 2017 at 7:38 pm - Reply

      And what exactly is fed to farm animals? Air? The argument against veganism and its effect on environment is invalid if you eat meat or other animal products since you consume not only animal products/meat itself but also all the soya/grains/other crops and food that was required to sustain animal’s life in the first place.

    • Robert Cortes January 30, 2017 at 8:28 pm - Reply

      Lina, the difference between cows and humans is that you can literally let a cow roam in a field with perennial grass without having to use machines, for humans to survive off of just plants, you need to use machines to cultivate the large amount of veggies and fruits for us to live off of. Cows eat prickly pear too wherever it’s abundant.

    • Vanessa Vieira January 30, 2017 at 8:54 pm - Reply

      I don’t think insects is “splitting hairs” at all. If you want to really speak to animal death then ALL life counts. You cannot select what fits your argument best. You have to see the entire picture for what it is. As humans we need to do better in it all. Not eating meat isn’t the end all solution

    • Zoe Norquoy January 30, 2017 at 9:07 pm - Reply

      Vanessa Vieira its a start

    • Lina Mukovozova January 31, 2017 at 12:38 am - Reply

      Robert Cortes What prevents humans from growing their own food if they complain about environmental damage? How much machinery is used to cultivate food for farm animals? Also, got to mention that not many farmers keep cows outside as most dairy cows, for example, spend their time inside being hooked to milking machines – it’s a business, not a sanctuary and people are making money out of it. If you are trying to create a picture of a happy cow roaming a field as shown on TV for gullible people to watch, please do a research on how detrimental meat and dairy industry is not only to animals themselves, but also environment. This is fueled by demand for meat and animal products, it leads to increased breeding and higher demand for food in order to feed these animals, which results in having to produce more food to feed animals than to feed people. Not to mention clean water usage and disposal of toxic animal feces – again, very damaging to environment.

    • David Taborda Correa January 31, 2017 at 2:16 am - Reply

      Jordan Gifford The EPA has also recognized the contribution cow farts are making to Earth’s greenhouse gases, stating earlier that globally, livestock are the “largest source of methane from human-related activities,” and are the third largest source of methane in the U.S. A 1995 study of methane emissions from cattle found that cows typically lose about 6 percent of their ingested energy as methane, partly a result of their slow digestive process. A single cow can produce between 250 and 500 liters, or about 66 to 132 gallons, of methane a day (the average U.S. vehicle gas tank can hold about 16 gallons of gas). no more things to said.. i’m stupid you are ignorant buddy!! if you take this to a big scale i’m still right over your “theory of harvesting machines pollution”.. lol

    • Jordan Gifford January 31, 2017 at 7:09 am - Reply

      David, you’re still pretty stupid. Comparing a 16-gallon car to a 700 gallon or bigger harvesting machine that refuels multiple times a day. That’s 1,000s of gallons for just one. And there are millions of those things. Some so big they don’t release specifications for them. And there aren’t any studies on them cause the World Bank owns all of the agriculture. Screw your study in 1995. It’s all biased cause the World Bank doesn’t want to stop making billions. It’s not a theory. It’s real and happening right now. Science says the meat industry causes 18 percent of the methane globally and the methane created will dissipate within 6-12 years. Meanwhile, the world Bank says it causes 50 percent of the Earth’s methane emissions. Hmmm, should I trust money hungry looking to screw over anyone and everyone or some scientist not bought by big banks or corporations?

    • Tony Wheeldon January 31, 2017 at 11:49 am - Reply

      A lot of crops that are grown as broad-acre monocultures heavily reliant on pesticides and herbicides have effects well beyond the boundaries of the production areas into water tables and catchments. The goal is to have large areas or a singe crop replacing the previous ecosystems and everything in them. Cattle rangeland grazing still supports much broader and extensive populations of other animals and plants. So he has a point. Some studies I have seen claim up to 25 times more animals are killed or lost in cropping. A good example would be in the conversion of forests to palm oil plantations and in the deaths to orangutans directly from clearing and burning for the creation of those plantations and indirectly from the loss of food sources and habitat. So no cause to be smug…

    • Sean Daws January 31, 2017 at 7:14 pm - Reply

      Real vegans don’t consume palm oil.

    • Morten Stenberg January 31, 2017 at 10:52 pm - Reply

      Please don’t kill the plants, they produce oxygen from carbon dioxide…

    • Tony Wheeldon January 31, 2017 at 11:08 pm - Reply

      Sean Daws soya is having much the same impacts in south america. And because more crops of the total agricultural area is being diverted to ethanol production more land gets cleared including more marginal land and also leading to overuse of existing crop land and soil depletion. “Real” vegans are just as responsible as everyone else.

  40. Inge Papp January 30, 2017 at 3:19 pm - Reply

    This is the dumbest thing I’ve ever read. What does he think livestock animals eat? That’s right: they eat plants. Tons and tons and tons of plants, far more than a vegetarian or a vegan ever could. And those plants have to be grown somewhere.

    • Scott Bell January 30, 2017 at 3:23 pm - Reply

      That’s your argument? Animals eat tons of plants? Not too bright lmao

    • Keira Joan Clark January 30, 2017 at 3:26 pm - Reply

      You’re clearly not to bright because she obviously meant his argument is invalid as people need to grow crops to feed animals, if the growing and harvesting of crops is responsible for killing wildlife, then the meat industry is still contributing to more killing because it takes a lot more crops to feed farm animals than it does to feed humans.

    • Avery Maskell January 30, 2017 at 3:27 pm - Reply

      Yeah. The argument is that far more plants go into feeding food animals than go into a vegetarian/vegan’s diet. Thus, while still inevitably causing some harm, theirs is greatly reduced.

    • Avery Maskell January 30, 2017 at 3:30 pm - Reply

      I think it very obvious that that was the intended logic.

    • Isis Vayuna January 30, 2017 at 3:34 pm - Reply

      Not to mention that you need place where to grow the animals and the food of the animals.

    • Ian Kruger January 30, 2017 at 4:47 pm - Reply

      Scott Bell, You just made a dumbass out of yourself. Seriously…

    • Evelien Temmink January 30, 2017 at 5:05 pm - Reply

      That doesn’t mean he deserves your harsh reactions. Why?

    • Desiree Kruspel January 30, 2017 at 5:45 pm - Reply

      because he was the one insulting her in the first place? (not too bright) while being wrong, just saying.. might even be just another internet troll, that’s how stupid his argument is

    • Anna Ann January 30, 2017 at 5:55 pm - Reply

      Exactly well said

    • Adelle Murphy January 30, 2017 at 6:11 pm - Reply

      Calling people not too bright and using big words like dumbass… WOW.. you really showed us… youre so intelligent we should immediately agree with you. Regardless if you agree with anyone else. Youre adding nothing of value to the conversation therefore, based on what you alone have presented us about yourself, you are nothing but a keyboard troll!

    • Ryan Pal January 30, 2017 at 6:13 pm - Reply

      They eat grains and whatever they are fed..

    • Patricia Pauline Roe January 30, 2017 at 6:31 pm - Reply

      But that does not negate the argument. It is true. Grain fields and their maintenance contribute directly and indirectly to the killing of animals.

    • Lauren E. McKeracher January 30, 2017 at 6:51 pm - Reply

      Scott Bell scary how you totally missed the point. Like, wow.

    • Lee Gallacher January 30, 2017 at 7:22 pm - Reply

      You sound like you need a steak

    • Peter Gallagher January 30, 2017 at 7:30 pm - Reply

      I think he means that grazing animals like cows for milk and meat do not have the farmers destroying birds that are a pest to horticulturalists growing food crops. This is mainly true although beef growers in some climates have to lot feed animals grains during winter. This is usually the lower grade cereals. Beef farmers tend to destroy fox and rabbits and spread natural manure to enrich the Pasteur. These are environmental pests. He has a strong case for free grazing animals.

    • Paula Davis January 30, 2017 at 10:59 pm - Reply

      GMO corn grows like weeds. Nothing can kill em but they will kill you in the long run. No big deal, you have a recliner & TV. What more could a person need ‍♀️

    • Amber Ferguson January 31, 2017 at 12:00 am - Reply

      Most factory animals are fed a product made from broken down Corn. Not “tons and tons of plants”. Corn is cheapest to feed them, so that’s what they use.

    • James Jurome January 31, 2017 at 12:26 am - Reply

      I only eat grass fed meat. Aka cows that eat wild grass……

    • Chen Gui January 31, 2017 at 1:09 am - Reply

      SOLUTION IS TO ONLY EAT WILD ANIMALS KILLED FROM HUNTING? THEN WHOLE WORLD CAN BE NATURAL AND WILD, NO NEED FOR LAND TO GROW CROPS

    • Mike Garvin January 31, 2017 at 2:28 am - Reply

      So y’all are telling me that me and my son’s goin out in November and shooting several deer each is wrong?

    • Laird Liam Spence January 31, 2017 at 2:35 am - Reply

      Actually a lot of livestock eat the parts of a harvest which humans cant eat. That or they graze.

    • Amanda Bagnall January 31, 2017 at 2:43 am - Reply

      Free range livestock. Not that crazy of an idea. I haven’t noticed many feed lots in my area for over a decade. Boulder CO is huge for sustainably farmed everything from local farms tho…

    • Ang Romero January 31, 2017 at 4:54 am - Reply

      Just a quick reminder that 80% of the soy crops produced worldwide are destined for cattle feeding. We could easily live just with a portion of the land tended to. That means that most places would be left untouched. I would also like to say that there are small Brazilian tribal communities that plant their greens in the jungle’s soil, they don’t even need to cut down trees for that matter. There is also a huge advantage in seaweed production, since it doesn’t even need soil or desalinated salt in it’s production, and it’s rich in proteins and many minerals, plus it can also be transformed into fuel. It can even be grown within certain toxicity levels.

    • Sandy Peattie January 31, 2017 at 5:12 am - Reply

      Anna Ann you didn’t read it either did you? Most meat is grass fed in wide open pastures.

    • Ila Cooper January 31, 2017 at 6:27 am - Reply

      Those plants replenish on their own and are not affected by humans clearing land for crops. Natural systems worked exceptionally well until humans got to greedy and too many to respect those systems. He is absolutely correct. Most livestock no longer eat plants and grass they are fed on crop waste and other cheap alternatives even skiddles candy because it’s cheaper than corn. Nature and animals lived in symbiosis until man thought he knew better and our populations and greed became more than nature could handle.

    • Brett Rockich January 31, 2017 at 6:52 am - Reply

      The words right out of my brain!!

    • James Norel January 31, 2017 at 7:01 am - Reply

      same goes for the monumental amounts of land needed to grow plant food for humans sunshine

    • Vivien Dunne-Murphy January 31, 2017 at 7:39 am - Reply

      Corn is a plant

    • Russell F. Crawley January 31, 2017 at 7:43 am - Reply

      Grass bitch. Grass

    • Jason De Mesa Montalvo January 31, 2017 at 7:43 am - Reply

      Do vegans eat grass?

    • Abdullah Ahad Chowdhury January 31, 2017 at 8:39 am - Reply

      Then y do u have canine and incisor teeth, break them off u fokin vegan shit

    • Lawrence AF January 31, 2017 at 1:10 pm - Reply

      Fair point… HOWEVER! As the guy says, the moment agriculture came to be the environment already started to change… if you don’t kill the livestock they live longer meaning you have to feed more, free them and they will destroy the ecosystem, the ecosystem with them now is essentially “controlled”, it would be chaotic destruction otherwise, eat them or don’t eat them, the stage we are at in life is death anyway, you’re not better than those who eat meat, they aren’t better than you, we are however consuming our natural diet, you choose not to thinking it’ll make a difference, and many vegans just plainly think arrogantly of themselves, not all, but many

    • Ben Boltwood January 31, 2017 at 1:36 pm - Reply

      Ru seriously that void of understanding,the plants that animals eat are not grown somewhere,they come from nature,what he is saying makes absolutely perfect sense, clearly he got his reasoning from observation as opposed to the simple minded people who get their information from the TV set or a super market tabloid

    • Anagha Samprathi January 31, 2017 at 1:46 pm - Reply

      Couldn’t have put it better myself!

    • Sean Daws January 31, 2017 at 6:56 pm - Reply

      Thos canines tho
      Gotta murder animals because teeth.

    • James Allardise January 31, 2017 at 7:00 pm - Reply

      It’s hilarious when the guy who resorts to personal insults just so happens to be the one with reading difficulties ;

      Enter the prize dumb ass , Scott Bell ! 🙂 🙂 🙂

    • Molly Schmoo Chase January 31, 2017 at 8:11 pm - Reply

      Ya they’re actually taking up 30% of the worlds land mass with the food we grow for them! So if you want to depend less on industrial agriculture and reduce your impact you will eat closer to the source, just plants

    • Kev Whu Byrne January 31, 2017 at 8:59 pm - Reply

      Pmsl mass production of meat cows etc dont get to eat in fields lol most are fed on man made products to make them fat lol another deluded veggy

    • Lawrence AF January 31, 2017 at 10:21 pm - Reply

      Sean Daws you saying that to kill for food makes you a murderer or you being sarcastic because of the image? If your being legitimate then many primates, many mammals, reptiles, birds and fish are “murderers”, there are vegan sites that will falsely tell you chimpanzees eat very little meat if any at all because their biologically herbivores… in fact many of our physiological traits do suggest herbivorous dietary needs, unfortunately for vegans and their lying websites we do have a number of physiological traits that allow us to digest meat, where pure herbivores cannot do so at all… that indicates an omnivorous diet, it’s not just about teeth, only thing that needs to be changed about the meat industry is the treatment and methods, just as the indigenous people of all lands were respectful of animals including their own pray

    • Harwill Diemling February 1, 2017 at 8:19 am - Reply

      Ryan Pal Skittles candy too. Along with faeces.

    • Harwill Diemling February 1, 2017 at 8:21 am - Reply

      Ben Boltwood please explain how GMO grain comes from nature?

    • Harwill Diemling February 1, 2017 at 8:25 am - Reply

      Lawrence Adam-Fiorillo If you are a natural omnivore then you should be able to eat meat in its raw state like the animals you quoted. You can with vegetables.

  41. Christopher Tyson January 30, 2017 at 3:19 pm - Reply

    This debate is so old and annoying

  42. Martin Looij January 30, 2017 at 3:22 pm - Reply

    Sounds fair enough 🙂

  43. Jannie de Lange January 30, 2017 at 3:22 pm - Reply

    Only people who live the lifestyle of vegetarianism linked with spirituality will untimately know the truth not people who claim to know yet rejoice in ignorance

    • Isis Vayuna January 30, 2017 at 3:36 pm - Reply

      Yes! Wise words

    • Samantha Felthaus January 30, 2017 at 4:01 pm - Reply

      *veganism ☺ x

    • Zachary Frye January 30, 2017 at 4:03 pm - Reply

      Vegans have no spirituality that’s just the lack of nutrients making them delusional

    • Vicky Carr January 30, 2017 at 11:52 pm - Reply

      It’s not very spiritual to kill and then eat the flesh of your victim. Name a nutrient…vitamin…mineral that is only found in meat?

    • Jason De Mesa Montalvo January 31, 2017 at 7:55 am - Reply

      Connecting plant murder with spirituality..is it really wise? Remember,we are born omnivore.. Name a vegan saint..there are none.. Even Jesus eat fish..

  44. Eric Cavatore January 30, 2017 at 3:23 pm - Reply

    Yes, of course, some farmers do kill animals to protect their crops. But they have a choice, they don’t have to kill every time nor all animals. There are also new developing ways to grow produce in controlled environment limiting wild animals contact.
    Eating meat does require direct killing of the animal you eat, and it also requires to feed those meat-animals, with crops that are intensively grown and whose farmers do kill animals to protect their crop. Those farmers generally don’t go through the expense or trouble of finding alternative ways to grow their crops either.

    So while, unless you stop eating anything altogether may prevent the killing of animal the most, not eating meat and not wearing animal skins does significantly reduce the killing of animals, especially in horrific conditions, more that doing nothing.
    On top of that, eating meat is not healthy and also kills people.

  45. Joe Baxter January 30, 2017 at 3:23 pm - Reply

    Plants are living organisms too

    • Jonathan Oakes January 30, 2017 at 4:49 pm - Reply

      The smell of fresh cut grass is actually a chemical released by the plants due to stress! Basically they are screaming in smell!

    • Joe Baxter January 30, 2017 at 6:06 pm - Reply

      Trees communicate with each other too

    • Jonathan Oakes January 30, 2017 at 6:43 pm - Reply

      They communicate with everything! Those scents are the language they use to talk to each other, animals,and insects.

  46. Isis Vayuna January 30, 2017 at 3:23 pm - Reply

    If you use logic you can see he is quite wrong. But it is true that a lot of vegan people are not so friendly with the environment as they like to think.

  47. Martín Leonardo Plada Polonioli January 30, 2017 at 3:24 pm - Reply

    The idea of the article is: “if someone must die, why don’t we kill everyone?”. A stupid falacy. And the article is old.

  48. Sundy Georgiou January 30, 2017 at 3:25 pm - Reply

    BULLSHIT! Farmers are working in land anyway to feed the animals they are going to eventually be killed in the slaughter houses for you to eat. 40% of the worlds harvest goes to animal feedings, which this translates to 30% of earth’s land mass. Not to mentions the numbers on water consumption and air pollution animal farms produce. And to conclude this a vegan diet is 15 times less harmful to our mother earth than a meat eater. DON’T be fooled by these paid commercials for meat industry trying to convince you to keep eating animals.

  49. Frida Hilja January 30, 2017 at 3:25 pm - Reply

    And where does the animals get their food from? Come on!!

  50. Jose Antonio Zamora January 30, 2017 at 3:26 pm - Reply

    Makes sense. Nice article

  51. Andreas Fürst January 30, 2017 at 3:27 pm - Reply

    what does he think are animals eating ? i think there are so many rainforest gone just to provide food for the animals which need a lot miore than humans..
    and of course he s from argentina…;-)

    • Pablo Fernandez January 30, 2017 at 4:02 pm - Reply

      They destroy more forests and jungles for agriculture and plant based food than animmal feeding. Im with all of you with nature protection. but the problem is not what we eat, the problem is our lost memory of our relationship with nature.

    • Patricia Pauline Roe January 30, 2017 at 6:42 pm - Reply

      Livestock and humans should not be eating grains in the first place.

    • Mandy Jo Angleberger January 30, 2017 at 9:20 pm - Reply

      Livestock should only be eating grass. Free range. And you grow one patch of grass to the side and let it die (hay) for them to eat through winter. No crops, just grass.

    • Pablo Fernandez January 30, 2017 at 11:54 pm - Reply

      Barry Karyab i did not discard that animals also affect the loss of forests, i only said what i said. READ.

  52. Cameron Smith January 30, 2017 at 3:28 pm - Reply

    I’m a vegetarian (Working my way to vegan eventually)by the fact it makes my body feel better and more energized. The way the article describes how we’re killing animals is a process of mass production. Yes no matter what we do animals will die. And plants are living consciousness entities too. Anyone who doesn’t think so is deluding themselves (they have memories and communicate proven by science). But vegans cause is to cause as little suffering as possible. In slaughterhouses animals are tortured as well as in dairy farms. I had to protest pizza for months because the companies were allowing their workers to stab cows for the fun of it. I’ve been stabbed before it doesn’t feel nice. Mostly reading that article my first thought was they are doing it wrong. That is a wrong way to make food. Personalized gardens to produce your own food. If have to hunt do it minimally and make sure the animal does not suffer. The old ways were best. No pesticide, No poisons, share the food. As for populace control I agree there are too many of us. In basic ecology they teach every species has a natural predator that keeps them from
    Over populating where is our predator ? If we do not have one why? If we do not have one it is up to us to control our population level by birthing restrictions. More so now that we have technology on the horizon that could make us live for a thousand years.

    • Sandy Stackowitz Crandell January 30, 2017 at 3:42 pm - Reply

      Families are statistically smaller than in past years, so population control would have to be extreme. It wouldn’t be able to just include new population, but also the older population. With science alone, people are living longer, people are birthing multiple babies..add in a few more factors and it’s clear that it will not slow down any time soon

    • Cameron Smith January 30, 2017 at 4:01 pm - Reply

      agreed, unfortunately I am not a fan of mass murder. Like said without a predator that option is off the table. So the other option we is to give boot corporations and corporate guides policies and start using better and more easily renewable resources like hemp. Or this tech that 13 year old boy perfected the Tessa coil by making it where it gathers energy from the particles around it in the air.

    • Bernadette Kuhns January 30, 2017 at 7:03 pm - Reply

      Humans do have a predator…diseases of many faces.

    • Cameron Smith January 30, 2017 at 7:06 pm - Reply

      Diseases then are failing their duties. because with enough healthy habits and alkaline diet disease can not survive in a human body.

  53. Adrian Vasquez January 30, 2017 at 3:28 pm - Reply

    Meat is good. So are vegetables. They go great together.

  54. Bobby Howareya Son January 30, 2017 at 3:28 pm - Reply

    who gives afuck be greatful you have food to eat

  55. Kizte Ami Kamelian January 30, 2017 at 3:29 pm - Reply

    spelt iz better for us than wheat.. thats why thair isnt much on the shelves at the local supermarkets

  56. Casey Marcella January 30, 2017 at 3:29 pm - Reply

    Well no sh*t. If we just plain LIVE then we kill animals. We kill everything. But being veg can at least help slow down the process and help eliminate a lot of unnecessary torture and suffering. And because of that love for animals and nature we will innovate and find better ways as we already are doing. ✌

  57. Tyler Bushre January 30, 2017 at 3:30 pm - Reply

    The vegans and vegetarians are having some cognitive dissonance.

  58. Laura Collings January 30, 2017 at 3:31 pm - Reply

    Oh PLEASE!!!!!

  59. Paddy Doran January 30, 2017 at 3:31 pm - Reply

    Rodrigo an interesting point of view

  60. Trina Jars January 30, 2017 at 3:32 pm - Reply

    Being vegan is the best we can do.

  61. Morgan Ruhl January 30, 2017 at 3:33 pm - Reply

    Another stupid article to try to stop the increase of vegans and vegetarians. I’m guessing the author was on the meat industry’s pay roll. Many of our crops are used to feed the animals that are largely over breeded and then slaughtered to feed all the meat eaters. It was a nice try but most vegans/vegetarians do their research which is why we choose to not eat meat. Plus, giving up meat is not just for animals. It also benefits to our health and helps the environment!

    • Jimi James January 31, 2017 at 12:47 am - Reply

      Agreed, but giving up meat is not necessarily better for our health. Eating a SMALL amount of quality red meat within a balanced, mostly plant based diet would be healthiest

  62. Mike Edmonds January 30, 2017 at 3:35 pm - Reply

    No matter what the choice is it affects the world. It is childish to not understand that there is always a trade off.

  63. Michael Vieira January 30, 2017 at 3:37 pm - Reply

    150 billions animals (land and marine) are killed every year only in the USA..
    95% of soy production is for animal comsumption.. this is fake news.

    listen to this man
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQCe4qEexjc&t=9s

  64. Tyler Norman January 30, 2017 at 3:37 pm - Reply

    Look at Yellowstone park, before they reintroduced wolves into the park, the local herbivores were suffering because they were out consuming their food sources due to extensive overpopulation. There is a reason man screws up so many things… it takes a lot to calculate what every single action influences… and most don’t want to do that.

  65. Andrew Parry January 30, 2017 at 3:38 pm - Reply

    True. Should be fruigavors. Problem solved.

  66. Paula Boss January 30, 2017 at 3:38 pm - Reply

    Too many meat eaters have no clue about what they’re putting in their bodies. But that same argument works for veggers. The goal should be that of wiccans….first, do no harm. All of us sitting on our phones and computers wasting time on Facebook are contributing to air and ground pollution. Unplug!

    • Josh Blomfield January 30, 2017 at 3:59 pm - Reply

      What if we run on solar or have an energy provider that offers a carbon neutral plan. Plus, the meat industry contributes more to greenhouse gasses and climate change than all of transport. And what even is a vegger..

    • Paula Boss January 30, 2017 at 7:13 pm - Reply

      🙂 vegger – vegan, vegetarian – eater of veggies. As far as unplugging, I was being somewhat ironic: I’m on both. However, the people reading this aren’t the ones that need convincing/encouragement about leaving a softer footprint on the earth.

  67. Rajesh Balakrishnan January 30, 2017 at 3:39 pm - Reply

    Two silly arguments to continue mindless killing of animals in the guise of expert knowledge. Both failed miserably . He can still gnaw on his piece of meat if he wants to but people are not stupid . Animals are gran fed so they too require grains. Assuming that forest are being destroyed to grow crops is even sillier . Agricultural lands being wasted and converted into land for construction is the real issue. We can still preserve the Forest and the wildlife. And we can still grow crops and grow more trees in barren areas . Commercial animal farming has to stop . For reasons of global warming , carbon footprints , greenhouse gases , un-economic output and mindless cruelty for a few moments of gluttony . And these animals don’t Produce OXYGEN !!……the most important element to sustain life itself ……the author needs to get a life …..and brains need a bit of oxygen ……the soul knows what is wrong and what is right so living in denial also won’t help ….hope he does some soul searching …,

  68. Ciaran Donnelly January 30, 2017 at 3:41 pm - Reply

    Lorna Donnelly I am making a bigger contribution being a Coeliac than you are being a Vegetarian it seems

  69. Sara Franzese January 30, 2017 at 3:41 pm - Reply

    I’ve read this flimsy argument before; that it continues to be circulated as if it’s a powerful revelation is embarrassing. NO ONE on this planet can say that they have never contributed, at the very least indirectly, to the death of a living being. However, being vegan is a lifestyle that seeks to eliminate harm to animals as much as possible. Claudio doesn’t seem to understand how supply and demand works. If less people are eating animals, that means less animals will even be brought into this world only to be abused and killed. He mentions veggie / grain farming but what he conveniently leaves out, is that most grains being produced are feeding livestock. The amount of land needed for vegetables and grain would be far less if animal consumption was low, and that would mean far less wildlife being killed for being “pests”. Most vegans are hyper aware of other factors that kill insects, birds, and other wildlife and as an example, stay away from foods produced with pesticides; opting for food that is locally grown, organic, non-gmo as much as possible. Paying for and participating in the killing of animals is significantly lower in a vegan lifestyle.

    • Karoline Lessa January 30, 2017 at 4:34 pm - Reply

      Very well said

    • Carmo Andrade January 30, 2017 at 5:24 pm - Reply

      If there were more people eating vegetables only, the amount of land would be less? That doesn’t make sense…

    • Carmo Andrade January 30, 2017 at 5:26 pm - Reply

      Plants are living beings too, in that case.

    • Sara Franzese January 30, 2017 at 5:31 pm - Reply

      Carmo Andrade no, the amount of land needed for farming grains / veggies would be less. there is no way a human consumes as much grain as a cow does on a daily basis.

    • Sara Franzese January 30, 2017 at 5:35 pm - Reply

      Carmo Andrade and i am not sure what your point is about plants… i am guessing it’s the whole “plants feel pain too” argument. if that’s the case, i encourage you to watch a video of someone harvesting grain and then one of a pig being slaughtered. spoiler alert, it’s not the same thing.

    • Maeve McCluskey January 30, 2017 at 5:50 pm - Reply

      Carmo Andrade plants are not living in the same sense as cattle,sheep etc.

    • Patricia Pauline Roe January 30, 2017 at 6:41 pm - Reply

      As long as humans consume grains and feed livestock grains that should otherwise be eating grass and insects then they are part of the problem.

    • Eckard Nieman January 31, 2017 at 8:59 am - Reply

      What’s wrong with farming responsibly and treating the animals well? We probably should be having much less meat, and when we do farm with animals, they should be treated much better. Problem solved.

    • Tim Ridden January 31, 2017 at 9:36 am - Reply

      Eckard Nieman for people opposed to raising livestock for meat, the problem arises in their suffering for example a mother dairy cow feels emotional pain when her calf is torn from her care and dragged off to be slaughtered. A cow raised for meat feels fear when they are put on cattle trucks bound for the slaughterhouse, then the pain of having a captive Bolt pistol kill them or knock them senseless as they are cut apart for consumption. I suppose the question you need to ask yourself is, for a animal that is born purely to die, is that really a life that anything with the capacity to feel both emotional and physical pain deserves?

    • Jay Fitton January 31, 2017 at 12:27 pm - Reply

      Yes ok.. you have a point. Organic production is much better than mono cropping and pesticides, but in order to produce organic vegetables you need animal input such as manure or blood and bone to provide plants with essential nutrients. So if you want to be vegan and not eat anything that has had animals involved in the process, then you can go and eat artificially produced vegetables. This makes this argument moot. Plants need animals and animals need plants. I used to be vegetarian but then I realized that it’s all just energy transfer…

    • Naynah-Simone Greenwood January 31, 2017 at 1:42 pm - Reply

      Pretty sure animals can poo without being harmed

    • Sara Franzese January 31, 2017 at 2:06 pm - Reply

      Jay Fitton that won’t be necessary as there are ways to farm crops without getting animals’ waste /bone / blood involved. They aren’t plentiful, but there are farms who already produce vegetables and grain using plant based methods. There is no reason not to believe that farming can and will keep evolving. There is no way I would cease being vegan just because I don’t have full control over what my food is grown in. Also, I don’t even think using manure to grow crops has to necessarily be part of an unethical industry. For example, I am not sure what places like the farm sanctuaries do with all of it, but it has to go somewhere anyway, and if it gets used to grow crops, which is the most eco-friendly thing to do, I don’t see a battle there worth fighting for animal lovers.

    • Alex Mulley January 31, 2017 at 4:33 pm - Reply

      Most fruits and Vegetables are GMO and so many are disillusioned about this topic. Do some research, there is not much domestic food on this planet that has not been altered. I agree that an overhaul of the agricultural process should happen, but trust me, most farmers/meat processors don’t want to be cruel to animals.Happy animals make farmers a lot more money. Yes, things go wrong sometimes, welcome to life. Coming to you from an ex farmer.

    • Kristin Middleton Alger January 31, 2017 at 5:30 pm - Reply

      Eckard Nieman what’s wrong with not eating someone that doesn’t want to be eaten. You can not kill humanely, it’s impossible. Farming responsibly would mean not farming animals for food, any other way is irresponsible and harmful to our planter and our bodies!

    • Tannia Meeth February 1, 2017 at 1:33 am - Reply

      The justification for confining, torturing, mutilating and killing other living, feeling beings debunked in 1 min. Now please stop making excuses and go VEGAN. ✌️http://bit.ly/2hZrqmH

  70. Tony Davies January 30, 2017 at 3:43 pm - Reply

    He does realise that a third of those crops are grown to feed livestock, right?

  71. Nalyd Wasteland January 30, 2017 at 3:46 pm - Reply

    This is ridiculous! You need much more veggies to feed animals than you need to feed people. If the whole world would be vegeterian we would need far less space for growing vegetables and fruits!

  72. Kayla Pohovich January 30, 2017 at 3:46 pm - Reply

    Corn and wheat are generally unhealthy… those crops are grown in mass amounts by companies like Monsanto and have more harmful effects than killing birds. They kill bees and other pollinators, and put holes in your gut causing major food allergies. I could go on. It shouldn’t be a matter of vegetarian vs. meat eater. It should be healthful vs. harmful food; organically grown/raised (the way nature intented) vs. industrially grown.
    And honestly, it seems like a larger growing percentage of people are understanding that.

  73. Chélee Brown January 30, 2017 at 3:47 pm - Reply

    15000 liters of water to produce 1kg of meat.

  74. Jean-Marc T January 30, 2017 at 3:48 pm - Reply

    Deceptive partial truths. This apologist for the meat industry failed to point out that 50% of the world’s crop production is used to feed livestock, not to mention that this figure is as high as 70% in the US alone.

  75. Edward W Whiting January 30, 2017 at 3:51 pm - Reply

    Eat in moderation. Do not waste. Be respectful of the animal. The body doesnt need that much meat. Too much can lead to a premature illness or death. Its simple.

  76. Christiane Kay January 30, 2017 at 3:53 pm - Reply

    What he says only applies to animals that are raised outside. There’s no “wildlife” in factory farms.
    Plus the very valid point of the way higher amount of plants needed to feed the animals.
    Haven’t read such a bullshit in a while!

  77. Chélee Brown January 30, 2017 at 3:53 pm - Reply

    I suggest this boet goes and watched fork over knives and cowspirasy and see it goes way just the killing of animals. Defrostation happens before space for the animals as well as plant food for animals and humans. Just their is probably some unethical farming practices going on. But the growth rate of animals is just not keeping up with the demand from humans hence why they are pumped with so much shit. Cows are one of the largest methane Gass producers which is destroying the ozone layer. The disease rates of cancer is increasing due to our shitty diets. I’m not say he is completely wrong but his article has kak loads of loop holes in

  78. Minato Hatake January 30, 2017 at 3:53 pm - Reply

    Can Vegans and Meat Eaters coexist and live together say in a marriage? (Just saying because nowadays everyone seems to break into groups and never really unite for anything, and when the call to unite comes everyone starts to argue and question each other). Fuck like I don’t give a shit if you eat plants the rest of your life why should you give a shit if I eat meat that’s what I am saying…. This is the problem with groups they all kind of tend to become fanatical to a point you judge people solely on things you think they are wrong for but they can be the best human being on the planet. If anything life is quite the conundrum

  79. Edward W Whiting January 30, 2017 at 3:55 pm - Reply

    All meat eaters should mandatorily visit slaughterhouses and see the sacrifices these animals unwillingly make. When i see half a steak left on a restaurant plate i really want to slap the person wasting it.

    • Jimi James January 31, 2017 at 12:36 am - Reply

      That’s right. If we didn’t waste so much food, we wouldn’t need nearly as much land for grazing and crop production as we do now. Minimise waste, eat less meat, substitute beef for more sustainable red meat like kangaroo, venison etc…

  80. Vidushi Shrivastava January 30, 2017 at 3:55 pm - Reply

    this is serious and deep topic, I’ve read half of it right now rest I”ll read later and get back to you,for sure.

  81. Zoanne Kabriel January 30, 2017 at 3:55 pm - Reply

    So is the wheat and corn raised where the rain forest was lost for the feeding of livestock for butcher or for human consumption. I think its for the meat. I became a vegetarian because when I looked at the meat I pictured the animal being killed… still hope that by not eating meat the humans will kill less animals.

  82. Josh Blomfield January 30, 2017 at 3:55 pm - Reply

    “fields of wheat there are no birds” Yes.. the fields of wheat being grown to overfeed animals.. for humans to eat! If we ate the wheat or grew healthy veggie crops we’d use less land…

  83. Linda Scott January 30, 2017 at 3:55 pm - Reply

    What a load of bollox this is! I think he wants to justify eating meat again because he has a craving for it, what an idiot.

  84. Le'q Estrada January 30, 2017 at 3:55 pm - Reply

    As the world shifts more and more towards veganism, studies show that the food supply for animals is deminishing. Omnivores believe in equality, they eat meat, fruits and vegetables, without expecting praise.

  85. Nishita Bajaj January 30, 2017 at 3:55 pm - Reply

    I’ll wait

  86. Vidushi Shrivastava January 30, 2017 at 3:56 pm - Reply

    Hari sir i would like to hear your views on this too,if you could please..

  87. Tim Jorgenson January 30, 2017 at 3:57 pm - Reply

    Haha thought this would get a reaction out of you.

  88. André Costa January 30, 2017 at 3:58 pm - Reply

    The crazy shit meat eaters come up with to justify their meat eating… Seriously people, if you want to keep eating meat, then by all means, eat it. Just don’t come up with nonsense “research” to say vegans and vegetarians are hurting more animals than you, when they aren’t.
    There are also a few other important benefits of being a vegetarian besides saving more animals, like better health (if you eat right) and it’s more environmental friendly.
    Please don’t feel bad for eating meat when we present you with facts, just do your research and if it makes sense to you, then reducing your meat intake is already helping a lot.

    • Mustafa Masri January 30, 2017 at 4:54 pm - Reply

      triggered

    • Jimi James January 31, 2017 at 12:44 am - Reply

      Better health would be to still eat meat, just far less than we do now. Red meat once a week is enough… Some vegos are more unhealthy than meat eaters… All depends on quantity and quality of food

  89. Pablo Fernandez January 30, 2017 at 3:59 pm - Reply

    Also Eating plants its also killing. No discrimination to LIFE. Every natural process is there for a higher reason than the human thought. Arrogance i call it. Capitalism and its abuse to mother nature manifests in destruccion of all nature, not only animals. We dont change nothing not eating meat, we do change the world investing your money in local markets and organic and plant based medicines. Protect mother earth.. Not only animals.. Love to all.

  90. Hazem Warhani January 30, 2017 at 3:59 pm - Reply

    you don’t benefit anything from not eating meat. so whats your point?

  91. Jake Fremo January 30, 2017 at 4:00 pm - Reply

    This way of thinking is very flawed, there is a much more simple solution. Grow your own food! Don’t kill the pest do your best to protect your food source from them. But if a rabbit gets a few leaves hey, thats the cycle of life, let it be!

    • Jimi James January 31, 2017 at 12:32 am - Reply

      If a rabbit gets a few leaves…..eat the rabbit. THAT’S the cycle of life. Plus rabbit is much more sustainable than beef

  92. Kridish Purmah January 30, 2017 at 4:02 pm - Reply

    Partial truth…

  93. Helen Sava January 30, 2017 at 4:04 pm - Reply

    I’ll just have to starve then.

  94. Murray Smith January 30, 2017 at 4:07 pm - Reply

    I hope this is fake for Argentina’s sake. Satire maybe? I dunno – this guy needs better friends.

    • Ryan Lithgow January 30, 2017 at 7:56 pm - Reply

      Nah it’s for real, Claudio makes some good points about the impact on wild animals from farming vegetables, seems most just don’t like what he said because it offends them rather than trying to understand what he is saying.

    • Ryan Lithgow January 31, 2017 at 2:58 am - Reply

      From what I can gather most of the ‘common knowledge’ seems to be assumption, not sure what his giant flaw is,

    • Murray Smith January 31, 2017 at 3:15 am - Reply

      He ignores the fact that a huge portion of cropland is devoted to animal feed and biofuels – nothing to do with vegetarians – more to do with meat consumption. That makes it pretty big.

      http://www.vox.com/2014/8/21/6053187/cropland-map-food-fuel-animal-feed

  95. Loren Ellis January 30, 2017 at 4:08 pm - Reply

    I hear his point but as in everything a balance must be found. Food statistics show that beef farming in particular has destroyed massive amount of ‘wild land’ so there you are killing both domestic and wild. Not a strong enough argument but I do hear what he is trying to say. Once again more people growning their own food and more use of permaculture farming is the answer.

    • Ryan Apnar January 30, 2017 at 4:27 pm - Reply

      Doesn’t most of our agriculture go to feeding livestock too?

    • Mandy Jo Angleberger January 30, 2017 at 9:24 pm - Reply

      It shouldn’t. Livestock should just be eating grass. If food was grown by family gardens instead of factory farms, a balance between wild and cultivated land could be met.

  96. Pharrtjar Bob January 30, 2017 at 4:08 pm - Reply

    fair enough but we do have modern practices of farming & agriculture which almost nullify even these problems among many others. unfortunately they are still not practised on a wide scale

  97. Hazem Warhani January 30, 2017 at 4:08 pm - Reply

    i actually thought you will say something like you can get the same nutrients from another source but obviously we have a dumb one here

  98. Sonya Watkins January 30, 2017 at 4:09 pm - Reply

    Humans do not have carnivores digestive tract

  99. Les Van Harlingen January 30, 2017 at 4:10 pm - Reply

    bottom line meat eater or not..to sustain life one must kill….either animal or plant..ll food sourse at on time has been living , no matter if you eat beef or just wheat..it is all living a…we kill an so o animals to live that is the law of nature and nothing can change that…

  100. Vivek Acharya January 30, 2017 at 4:13 pm - Reply

    Hahaha, i think i can post a bs and call myself some sort of naturalist too. The dude seems too much delusional. Because of meat and such products, so much animals are purposefully reared and where from do they feed them? What amount of plant life an animal eats and hence in few kilos of flesh that people eat of them , how much plants go along, whereas a vegetarian would perhaps eat that much plant in a year or two, maybe some amount less or more depending on the animal. And this crazy person should know that non veg people too consume vegetarian foods directly too. And talking about wheat fields and all, well even if i consider it, then it has to be attributed to increase in human population.

  101. Brendan Clark January 30, 2017 at 4:14 pm - Reply

    Animals eat animals . We’re in the animalia kingdom . Lol

    You think a lion gives a fuck when it tears the throat out of a gazelle?

  102. Svenja Kitty Pimps January 30, 2017 at 4:14 pm - Reply

    Hahahha most stupid thing I have EVER heard. Weil if the fields where all the plants are can’t be used by the wild animals, THEN you should know, how the domesticated animals are feeded: with plants!!! And they need a lot of plants! Plus the fields/ground used for the animals to stand on….

  103. Robert Brant January 30, 2017 at 4:15 pm - Reply

    They are starving the poor animals I hunt

  104. Loi Tran January 30, 2017 at 4:16 pm - Reply

    Claudio is probably being paid by the meat industry.

  105. Jose A. Fontanez Rodríguez January 30, 2017 at 4:17 pm - Reply

    This article makes sense if you have no sense. Even though it might be true that by committing to a vegan lifestyle you are also killing animals, the damage is less. Take into account how much land you have to clear for cattle. How much water that cattle needs. The feed the cattle will consume. Them tell me if the damage is proportionate. I am not a vegan, I wish I could have the character vegans have. I am, in baby step, becoming vegetarian. I just hate the cruelty towards animal. I would never impose my beliefs on anyone. But cruelty towards animals says a lot about a society.

  106. Ishaan Dehal January 30, 2017 at 4:18 pm - Reply

    We already know know this fact right? But it’s Still better then eating over bloated cow fed corn for a living. Plus vegetarian diets cleanse your body.

  107. Manish Mehta January 30, 2017 at 4:22 pm - Reply

    Why don’t you directly say.. you can’t resist the taste of meat idiots..
    I personally have been a non vegetarian ones… But fought with my own thoughts just to prevent life of that innocent creature… If you can’t become vegetarian then don’t become but don’t blame such sh.t on us.. we r far mentally stronger than u think.

  108. Raj Padma Iyer January 30, 2017 at 4:23 pm - Reply

    some people clearly r profit motivated …

  109. Fraser Mclean January 30, 2017 at 4:23 pm - Reply

    What was the actual point in this article essentially you kill animals whither you want to or not.

  110. Nicky Wood January 30, 2017 at 4:25 pm - Reply

    Mitchell Wood ….what’s this all about?

  111. John Alcock January 30, 2017 at 4:25 pm - Reply

    We all reap what we sow it’s About balance

  112. Quraab Bey January 30, 2017 at 4:26 pm - Reply

    For every action there is an equal an opposite reaction.

  113. Kevin Poet January 30, 2017 at 4:26 pm - Reply

    This is nothing more than a tit for tat arguement for those who want to consume meat. A vegan doesnt consume a 10th of the amount of animals being slaughtered everyday . No relevations here just rhetoric

  114. Sunil Jadhav January 30, 2017 at 4:32 pm - Reply

    Is he really a naturalist or just cuckoo. What about the millions of tons of feed grown and trillions of litres of water that is wasted to raise factory farmed animals. Not to mention all the greenhouse gases just from their excretion. Somebody please check his real education. This guy is a retarded quack!

  115. Kuu Hullu January 30, 2017 at 4:33 pm - Reply

    This doesn’t take in consideration a fact that those animals that you eat also eats something and if you are vegetarian cultivatoin of those fields is needed far less than to first feed an animal with the same crops and then eat that animal. This is simple, cow needs more food than a human does!

  116. Arijan Bejtulahi January 30, 2017 at 4:34 pm - Reply

    And planting lots of fruit tree would be good for everyone because raw is ideal for every animal and we would be eating so much less,because when you take your time,eat slower and chew,enjoy the food it takes about 15-20 min for the brain to detect that we’re full(maybe I’m wrong)
    Analyze the human body 🙂
    We don’t have big canines for tearing flesh ,claws for grabing pray,a jaw that goes only up and down,high acidity in our stomach for digesting raw flesh,short intestines etc.
    One love 😉

  117. SJ Anderson January 30, 2017 at 4:36 pm - Reply

    This is really reaching lol.

  118. Tatiana Grossmann January 30, 2017 at 4:37 pm - Reply

    He has a slight point, not the greatest point, but a point nonetheless.

  119. Edith Acosta January 30, 2017 at 4:37 pm - Reply

    Consequences. There’s one for EVERYTHING. At this point it’s gotten scary, the system of how we get any of our food has gone corrupt. So now as consumers, we gotta weight in the good, the bad, and the ugly. Choose accordingly, and may the odds be with you!

  120. Crystal White January 30, 2017 at 4:38 pm - Reply

    Small, local, and permaculture ….

  121. Andrew Weber January 30, 2017 at 4:38 pm - Reply

    Lol. Lone Argentinean scientist says entire UN science council is wrong….

    Sounds like you found your self the food equivalent of a scientist who doesn’t believe in global warming…

  122. Joe Booms January 30, 2017 at 4:39 pm - Reply

    What I always like is people won’t wear fur or leather b/c it came from an animal and that’s murder…. BUT they done blink an eye at wearing synthetic clothes that actually harm the enviroment both in production and decomposition. Go green wear fur!!!!!!!

  123. Igor Vrečko January 30, 2017 at 4:40 pm - Reply

    this guy isnt very bright is he?

  124. Arko Mukherjee January 30, 2017 at 4:40 pm - Reply

    Once feel the soul of that creature (fish.. Etc) when u r killing them..

  125. Haileigh Garoutte January 30, 2017 at 4:40 pm - Reply

    I’m glad so many people in the comments are calling this out. It took a lot of research before I made the decision to cut out meat – and one was the environmental impact. Growing livestock requires many many many times more grains/vegetables, water, and power than to simply eat the plants themselves and save the water. It is not efficient and it is worse for the environment (the number one factor in climate change is animal agriculture – yes, moreso than transportation!).

  126. Erik Hromada January 30, 2017 at 4:41 pm - Reply

    or lets all drink soylent, oh wait plants got feelings too

  127. Nick Marino January 30, 2017 at 4:42 pm - Reply

    This is so true, the massive amounts of grain fields in North America has exploded the geese populations, to the point where most places you can harvest 25 per day, and for a month you can shoot as many as possible, with unrestricted magazine capacity, and using electronic calls, and the geese still grow in numbers

    • Derwyn Booker January 31, 2017 at 5:50 am - Reply

      I am doing my best, but they want go back to the hunt area????

  128. Matt Supnick January 30, 2017 at 4:42 pm - Reply

    Yeah, but there’s a difference between requiring a dead body to eat and affecting environmental conditions by growing plants to eat. There is nothing inherently immoral about eating meat, but my point of view (and I think many others’ as well) is that it’s immoral because it requires the captive life and death of a sentient being.

  129. Saksham Rai January 30, 2017 at 4:45 pm - Reply

    But not like livestock maintenance.
    It’s the reason of 85% of deforestation. In turn leading to Global warming.
    Oops the scientist missed it dere .

  130. Danielle Russo January 30, 2017 at 4:47 pm - Reply

    This doesn’t account for all of the fields of grain used to feed livestock. These fields would be greatly reduced if everyone switched to plants only

  131. Yasir Hussain January 30, 2017 at 4:48 pm - Reply

    Lol

  132. Ambrōsher Hall January 30, 2017 at 4:51 pm - Reply

    This is very flawed information. Im not convinced. If I wrote this paper for school, I would surely get a C. Where are the facts? Im not a vegetarian, but I don’t see his logic really.

  133. Leo N Jessica January 30, 2017 at 4:51 pm - Reply

    The way i see it. Theyre killing the animals. To not eat it once theyve been killed is a waste of animal.

  134. Ramon Arturo Hernandez January 30, 2017 at 4:52 pm - Reply

    🙁

  135. Hanna Mercy January 30, 2017 at 4:52 pm - Reply

    Yeah plants have feelings too hahahahahaha

  136. Pauline Walsh January 30, 2017 at 4:52 pm - Reply

    Well Aoife Walsh John O’Connor you having big steak when you come home

  137. Franki Prim January 30, 2017 at 4:53 pm - Reply

    It is proven that if man didn’t eat meat your brain wouldn’t have developed to the point it has but after reading most of the comments here a lot of meat was wasted creating meat heads with canines that more than likely are anemic and iron deficient . Animals eat animals is it cruel when a zebra is killed by a lion no it’s nature and when all you vegetarians eat your eating my foods food so stop now before you starve all my food to death you cruel insensitive animals

  138. Shawn Rateau January 30, 2017 at 4:53 pm - Reply

    They left out the part of tearing down of forest to grow crops to feed the animals that are needed to feed the meat eaters.

  139. Kevin Baumgartner January 30, 2017 at 4:54 pm - Reply

    The man is 100% correct. But what do I know? I am just a member of PETA – people eating tasty animals.

  140. Jonathan Gilbert January 30, 2017 at 4:56 pm - Reply

    surely a pissed off carnivorian who wrote that!

  141. Troy Davis January 30, 2017 at 4:56 pm - Reply

    What do you think they feed those cows to get them to that size? According to the article “If all the grain currently fed to livestock in the United States were consumed directly by people, the number of people who could be fed would be nearly 800 million. Who eats more grain in a day a person or cow?buhttp://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/1997/08/us-could-feed-800-million-people-grain-livestock-eat

  142. Hari Singh January 30, 2017 at 4:56 pm - Reply

    Its an endless debate.
    Being Non Vegerterian is a matter of taste rather than survival.
    Human Beings have to be violent to survive.
    1. If we grow crops and target wild animals , the wild animals will certainly find out their way.
    But can this killing be compared with the deliberate reproduction and killing of lower animals?
    The lower animals also depend on crops unless we eat Omnivores animals. So now we need to kill wild animals for the growth of crops to feed lower animals just to finally kill them again.
    Isn’t it a very logical killing?
    So first we should find the ways out to reduce violence

  143. Sushil Yadav January 30, 2017 at 4:59 pm - Reply

    ..
    Industrial society has killed trillions of animals…….Industrial society has decimated millions of land and marine species…….Animal Holocaust came with industrialization……..Animal Holocaust is happening in this world every minute, every second…….It will continue as long as industrial society exists…….The only way to stop animal holocaust is by eradicating industrial society which has barely existed for hundred years…….There was very little killing of animals in pre-industrial society, so little that it was almost zero compared to the trillions of animals killed by industrial society…….Comparing pre-industrial killing of animals with industrial killing of animals is like comparing the Lamp with the Sun.

    Everyone is killing animals in industrial society………Those who are not killing animals directly for food are killing them indirectly for consumer goods and services……..Industrial activity for production of consumer goods and services has destroyed forests and oceans which has killed billions of wild animals and fish…….Industrial activity for production of electricity, oil, car, computer, television, washing machine, mobile phone and thousands of other consumer goods and services has destroyed billions of acres of forests which has killed billions of wild animals.

    Billions of acres of forests and billions of wild animals that lived in forests have been destroyed by Mining Industry, Logging Industry, Manufacturing Industry, Construction Industry, Electricity Industry, Oil Industry, Millions of kilometers of Road and Rail Networks, Hundreds of thousands of Ports and Airports.

    Industrial activity for production of consumer goods and services has destroyed oceans which has killed billions of marine creatures.

    Millions of tonnes of industrial chemicals, waste and oil spills have killed billions of fish and marine creatures.

    Industrial activity has made the oceans acidic and warmer…….It has created oxygen deprived dead zones in oceans…….This has killed billions of fish.

    Millions of tonnes of plastic waste has littered the land and oceans……..Millions of animals, coastal birds and fish are dying from either eating plastic or from getting entangled in plastic nets and ropes.

    All this killing was absent in agrarian society……..Every citizen of industrial society is a serial killer of animals, trees, air, water and soil.
    .
    .

    Industrial society has tortured, slaughtered and decimated millions of land and marine species………Industrial society has killed billions of wild animals and marine creatures by destroying forests and oceans with industrial activity for production of consumer goods and services……..Industrial society has killed trillions of farm animals in industrial slaughter houses……….Industrial society has killed trillions of fish with industrial fishing……..Industrial society has tortured millions of animals in zoos, circuses and science laboratories.

    Animals and environment are not saved by activism, organizations, discussion, debate, argument, philosophy or terminology………For millions of years before industrialization they were not saved by any of these…….In the absence of industrial activity they got saved automatically.

    Discussion cannot solve problems…….Millions of pages of debate is a disease of industrial society that invented the print industry, radio, television and internet………Millions of pages of debate is another toxic waste of industrial society which has also produced millions of tonnes of plastic waste, chemical waste, gaseous waste and e-waste.

    Industrial slaughter houses came with industrialization……..Meat and Fish Industry (which exists because of electricity, oil, transportation and refrigeration) came with industrialization……..Industrial society has killed trillions of animals and fish.

    There was very little killing of animals for food or any other reason in pre-industrial society.

    Today you can go to the market and buy unlimited quantity of meat…….This was not possible in pre-industrial society when most of the people lived in villages and there was hardly any meat market.

    The nonsense of eating meat or fish every day or several times a week is a consequence of industrialization.

    In pre-industrial society only those who lived near the river or ocean could eat fish every day……….In industrial society billions of people who are living hundreds and thousands of miles away from rivers and oceans are eating fish every day or many times a week because of Industrial Fishing, Industrial Transportation, Industrial Refrigeration and Industrial Marketing.

    In industrial society millions of tonnes of meat and fish are being sent from one country to another country, from one continent to another continent.

    In pre-industrial society most of the meat eaters could eat meat only on special occasions.

    In pre-industrial society most of the food was vegetarian most of the time.

    In pre-industrial society most of the people were vegetarian most of the time.

    In pre-industrial society very few animals and fish were available for killing and consumption in the absence of industrial farming of animals, industrial slaughter houses, industrial fishing, industrial transportation, industrial refrigeration, and industrial marketing.

    In pre-industrial society bulls and cows were needed for ploughing and tilling the fields…….for milk and manure…….for drawing out water from the wells……Cow dung cakes were used as fuel for cooking …….There was no way farmers would kill them for meat because their very survival depended on them.

    It was the arrival of tractors, electricity, diesel and electric pumps that made animals redundant for farming……..This led to mass slaughtering of cows.

    Most of the people in this world are alive today because of cows and bulls………It was cows and bulls that kept people alive for 10,000 years during the agrarian stage……..It was cows and bulls that sustained agriculture and farming for 10,000 years during the agrarian stage.

    Industrial society is slaughtering the very animal that kept its ancestors alive for 10,000 years in agrarian stage.
    .
    .

    Posting horrific pictures of animal torture in slaughter houses will not stop the meat industry just like posting horrific pictures of war victims will not stop the war industry.

    If I am not fighting the war in Syria and Iraq it doesn’t stop the war in Syria and Iraq……..If I don’t eat meat it doesn’t stop the meat industry…….Individual lifestyle changes cannot save animals or environment…….It is what the society does collectively that matters.
    .
    .

    Largescale hunting and poaching is a consequence of industrialization…….There was hardly any global trade in animal organs in pre-industrial society in the absence of Transportation Industry, Communication Industry and Marketing Industry.

    Torture of cows for milk is also a consequence of industrialization………In pre-industrial society more than 99% of population lived in villages……..Most people had cows……..People consumed milk produced by their own cows……..There was very little selling of milk for money or profit……..There was very little torture of cows for milk.

    In industrial society the urban population is not producing milk……..It is buying milk with money……..This has led to largescale torture of cows………Milk industry is torturing cows……..Milk corporations are torturing cows…….When the cows stop producing milk they are sent to the slaughter houses.

    Animals are not the only ones being killed by industrial society……..Industrial society has killed animals, trees, air, water and soil…….Industrial society has killed all living and non-living things on earth……..Industrial society has killed forests, rivers, oceans and atmosphere…….Every citizen of industrial society is a serial killer of animals, trees, air, water and soil.

    Environment has been destroyed by Mining Industry, Manufacturing Industry, Logging Industry, Construction Industry, Electricity Industry, Oil Industry, Automobile and Rail Industry, Airline and Shipping Industry, Meat and Fishing Industry.

    All industrial activity is interlinked and interdependent………Every industry promotes other industries………All industrial activity has collectively destroyed the planet.

    Hundred years of industrial activity has destroyed what was created by nature in millions of years.

    Industrialization = Destruction of forests, rivers, oceans and atmosphere.
    Industrialization = Torture, slaughter and decimation of millions of species.
    Industrialization = Billions of tonnes of plastic waste and chemical waste.
    Industrialization = Billions of tonnes of gaseous waste and ewaste.
    Industrialization = Killing of billions of acres of fertile soil with cement & concrete.
    Industrialization = Butchering of trillions of animals in slaughter houses.
    Industrialization = Poisoning of planet with nuclear waste for 50,000 years.
    Industrialization = Decimation of fish in the oceans by industrial fishing.
    Industrialization = Acidification and warming of the oceans.
    Industrialization = Oxygen deprived dead zones in the oceans.
    .
    .

    Man has spent more than 99.9% of his time on earth in non-industrial societies.

    Man lived in forests for hundreds of thousands of years……..Man lived in agrarian society for 10,000 years……..Man has lived in industrial society for just about 100 years during which he has destroyed the entire planet.

    If Urban Society stops its supplies to Rural Society it will live forever.
    If Rural Society stops its supplies to Urban Society it will die within a month.
    That is the worth of Urban Jobs, Consumer Goods, Growth Rate, Economy Rate and GDP.
    .

    Industrialization was the biggest crime on earth.
    Agrarian society was the limit for man on earth.

    http://www.envirolink.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2915
    Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment
    ..

  144. Salvatore Scaglione January 30, 2017 at 4:59 pm - Reply

    Very interesting point of view

  145. Niral Palwe January 30, 2017 at 5:02 pm - Reply

    This is brainless! How on earth do we have to destroy forests for providing vegetables? Makes no sense, on current numbers farmers producing more crops than before its even being stored. There is no shortage of crops, hell Americans throw away 40% of food everyday. So on what basis this guy came out with this shit! I don’t understand, if people becomes vegan then we don’t be needing excess of crops to feed animals and care to grow them. Proud to being vegan

  146. Harlie Hendrickson January 30, 2017 at 5:02 pm - Reply

    Humans just suck. We should all go back to being uncivilized wanderers and exist naturally on the earth instead of cultivating it for mass production. Let go of it all.

  147. Tracy Terry January 30, 2017 at 5:04 pm - Reply

    I don’t eat meat because I can’t stand to think of what it is ! I wish I could get over it, but I always think road kill.

  148. Malinda Beckham Schexnayder January 30, 2017 at 5:04 pm - Reply

    Susan Westlake-Munro what do you think about this argument?

  149. SneHa Dangwal January 30, 2017 at 5:08 pm - Reply

    True that. But due to vegans & vegetarians there must be less of unnecessary animal abuse.

  150. Silviu Negrutiu January 30, 2017 at 5:08 pm - Reply

    He’s got a point

  151. Robert Astleford January 30, 2017 at 5:09 pm - Reply

    What he’s failing to factor in is the land being cleared for grain is to feed cows.

  152. James Crawshaw January 30, 2017 at 5:09 pm - Reply

    Hippie’s

  153. Sarah Schnuck January 30, 2017 at 5:10 pm - Reply

    vegetarians are monsters.

  154. Jacob Lee Evenich January 30, 2017 at 5:10 pm - Reply

    This guy is right when discussing many modern farming practices. But Ranchers are even worse on wild animals. And farming has only been like this in the last 100 years. And its changing. And its only large Ag. Non organic farms who do this. Vegetarians/Vegans have never supported these farming practices. Actually it is they who have faught to change them.

  155. Bob Cook January 30, 2017 at 5:13 pm - Reply

    Good for thought .

  156. Timo Silva January 30, 2017 at 5:16 pm - Reply

    This is stupid yeah he makes a shitty argument but there is no solution in his statement it’s just about how we are still contributing to the killing of animals vegan or not what’s this guy’s solution then if we can’t eat plants or animals lol

  157. Zachary Ford January 30, 2017 at 5:19 pm - Reply

    Yea that’s my foods food damn it.

  158. Bethany Fontana-Wright January 30, 2017 at 5:25 pm - Reply

    Because vegetarians/vegans are the only ones who eat rice, corn and wheat, right..?

  159. Christopher de Leon January 30, 2017 at 5:28 pm - Reply

    Claudio Bertonatti is a stupid person i can’t believe that a human like him exist, stupidity level to the fullest

  160. Julia Hadjikyriacou January 30, 2017 at 5:28 pm - Reply

    Personally, I don’t want to be responsible the the violent slaughter, suffering and death of animals bred for their flesh. Secondly I do not wish to eat dead bodies & decomposed flesh. I am aware something has to die for me to live but I choose food with lower consciousness than sentient beings with families. There is nothing to eat with no loss of life unless yiu become a breatharian.

  161. Ajay Kumutha January 30, 2017 at 5:29 pm - Reply

    Meat is love.

  162. Ana Fajardo January 30, 2017 at 5:29 pm - Reply

    Halooo vegans or not killings or whatever! We have to follow food chains or not the world will not keep on moving around!! Understand what i mean?!?!

  163. Whitney Lee Bosseler January 30, 2017 at 5:30 pm - Reply

    People get way too offended over dumb shit like this. Its annoying. If you are going to get offended by an article why do you even go on the internet.

  164. Janet Gstattoos January 30, 2017 at 5:31 pm - Reply

    It’s the damn circle of life
    Get over it! We r all gonna die too just enjoy the damn tacos!

  165. Kasun Nawarathna January 30, 2017 at 5:31 pm - Reply

    Ha haaa…joke of the day..soo funny..:P poor bertonatti..this is just a damn personal opinion. While world organizations keep requesting from the people to go vegan to rescue the Planet Earth..this single man saying it doesnt make sense…who care about this fool :P…maybe trying to be popular..ha haa….this man doesnt know that f&cking animal industries killing the Planet Earth. This is the most stupid article ever seen……& also reporters should be more responsible…. today Mind Unleashed added a big black mark on them……
    & also I lost the trust and respect…..dont promote these type of shits….haters gonna hate…Vegans are blessed…
    <3 go vegan <3 save the planet!

  166. He Ed January 30, 2017 at 5:32 pm - Reply

    Vegetarian or not – humans are a virulent plague.

  167. Daniel Bédard January 30, 2017 at 5:32 pm - Reply

    Bullshit !
    Since the last 7 year’s, meat sales fell 16℅, Argentina #1 in sales of beef

  168. Nicolas de Waziers January 30, 2017 at 5:34 pm - Reply

    Yes!!! Save the birds!! But growing more corn for cattle is always worse than growing it for a human since we consume only a fraction of what cattle will in their lifetime.
    I wouldn’t be surprised if this guy is being payed by Argentinian meat lobbyists

    • Jeff Wright January 30, 2017 at 8:14 pm - Reply

      well duh!!! he’s from meat freaking country, Argentina!!!!

    • Mandy Jo Angleberger January 30, 2017 at 9:21 pm - Reply

      Corn is REALLY bad for cows. No crops necessary, just grass.

    • Jade Dorsett January 31, 2017 at 12:38 am - Reply

      Most cows are not grass fed.

    • Nicolas de Waziers January 31, 2017 at 3:10 pm - Reply

      And even if they are grass fed, how do you think the grasing grounds are made?! by curring down trees! 90% of all deforestation in Brazil is for freakin cows

  169. Stephanie Janelle Wagner January 30, 2017 at 5:34 pm - Reply

    I love meat!✊

  170. Paul LoBue January 30, 2017 at 5:36 pm - Reply

    Do any of you vegans own a cat?

  171. Ramses Mayorga Sr. January 30, 2017 at 5:38 pm - Reply

    they both taste good.

  172. Ryan Felix January 30, 2017 at 5:40 pm - Reply

    “This doesn’t fit my veiws, therefore, it is wrong” – V

  173. Alma Kazić January 30, 2017 at 5:43 pm - Reply

    So we are supposed to stop eating, everything and live off oxygen. Wow

  174. Lisa McKinney January 30, 2017 at 5:45 pm - Reply

    Interesting.

  175. Przemyslaw Slušný January 30, 2017 at 5:48 pm - Reply

    Why vegetarians are so fucked up? Because they have low level of serotonin precursors in their blood. Thats why there are discontent and unhappy all the time.

  176. Geena Saenz January 30, 2017 at 5:52 pm - Reply

    Nonsense.

  177. Iris Traarbach January 30, 2017 at 5:53 pm - Reply

    Yeh right.

  178. Angela J Taylor January 30, 2017 at 5:58 pm - Reply

    How ridiculous! Seems that the guy doesn’t realise that the animals humans eat consume massive amounts of farmed crops and that more land is taken because of it! I do wish people would educate themselves fully before publicly spouting such rubbish.

  179. Rodica Rodica January 30, 2017 at 6:01 pm - Reply

    How hilarious!

  180. Patrick Wojciechowski January 30, 2017 at 6:06 pm - Reply

    Interesting, but not exactly accurate. ….

  181. Mandy Williams January 30, 2017 at 6:09 pm - Reply

    Interesting

  182. Rick Watts January 30, 2017 at 6:13 pm - Reply

    I love steak.

  183. Ryan Pal January 30, 2017 at 6:13 pm - Reply

    Both kill animals just different ones…

  184. Samantha Palmer January 30, 2017 at 6:17 pm - Reply

    Hahahah what a crock! The deforestation is done to grow feed for the animals… humans consume waaaaaaY less than livestock ever would!

  185. Amedeo de Masi January 30, 2017 at 6:18 pm - Reply

    Stephanie Pagnillo this might be worth a look.

  186. Dylan Barrett Rutherford January 30, 2017 at 6:20 pm - Reply

    Pretty sure if I don’t eat meat…
    Don’t wear fur or leather,
    And don’t use animal byproducts…..

    Then what someone else does to kill animals isn’t put on me….

    Like seriously….

    I breath oxygen animals need to survive,
    So therefor I kill animals?

    No….

    I don’t hunt,
    I rescue injured animals,
    I feed strays,
    And although I’m not vegan…
    And still eat meat once every other month…

    I’m pretty sure I’m going to feel good about myself despite what some fear based shit post says….

    Piss off,

  187. Jacob Cooksey January 30, 2017 at 6:22 pm - Reply

    I don’t care bacon is delicious. You see a pet pig… I see a bacon tree

  188. Margaret Townsend January 30, 2017 at 6:23 pm - Reply

    The majority of grain is fed to the animals that are used and abused by the big corporate meat industry!

  189. Joseph Zdunek January 30, 2017 at 6:25 pm - Reply

    Just eat in moderation that’s the whole case, we eat in such abundance that wildlife and nature are being destroyed.. it doesn’t matter if you’re a vegan vegetarian meat eater.. everything has impact no matter what..

  190. Thao Ngo January 30, 2017 at 6:32 pm - Reply

    Plants have their own type of intelligence and will respond to the world around them. In response to predators attacking them, they will emit signals to attract the right animals or insects to defend them. I think perhaps just eating a variety of different food items, instead of always eating so much of the same thing over and over again. Find out what is sustainable and what isn’t and avoid eating the ones that have a shortage for a while? Just my two cents, lol.

    • Thao Ngo January 31, 2017 at 7:06 am - Reply

      Remember peeps, we need Mother Earth (including all the animals, insects, and plants, etc.) more than she needs us. 😉

  191. Len Swanepoel January 30, 2017 at 6:33 pm - Reply

    And your point is…?

  192. Andreea Oprea January 30, 2017 at 9:37 pm - Reply

    if less animals were eaten by humans, less land would be cultivated cause livestock needs far more cereals, grains,etc; in this case, less land would be needed for cultivation, so no deforestation needed. simple as that! don’t try to brainwash people and make them feel less guilty for meat consumption !!!

    • Jason De Mesa Montalvo January 31, 2017 at 7:59 am - Reply

      The nutrients in soil will deplete. That’s why cow poop is important.. Soil fertility,you think you can gain a crop on a barren land

    • Andreea Oprea January 31, 2017 at 8:19 am - Reply

      Jason De Mesa Montalvo so according to your thinking cows should be raised for the importance of their and then killed for meat… hmmmm?! How come I never thought about that?!
      I never mentioned cows should only exist for meat

  193. James Arthur Wilson January 30, 2017 at 6:42 pm - Reply

    Okay lets just not eat anything at all then for fuck sake and just starve to death

  194. Chetna Rikhari January 30, 2017 at 6:42 pm - Reply

    So what the hell we should do……… Eat meat & die of guilt…….. That my efforts are useless…. Huh….

  195. Rich Berends January 30, 2017 at 6:46 pm - Reply

    This article is very illogical. Live stock uses a lot of land and then add on the land all of the veggies are grown on to feed livestock. Google carbon emissions from meat industry. It’s bad. One expert even goes as far as to say “giving up beef will reduce carbon foot print more than cars.” There are so many other reasons this is completely wrong.

  196. Sana Zeitoun Fadel January 30, 2017 at 6:47 pm - Reply

    What about animals who are tortured in the process that provide your meat and leather?
    Don’t they deserve mercy??

  197. Stephano Green January 30, 2017 at 6:49 pm - Reply

    This guy needs to broaden his perspective

  198. Jennifer O'Connor January 30, 2017 at 6:50 pm - Reply

    This really makes no sense. It’s not that vegans think they don’t participate in killing – we all do by existing in our modern life. Just like we all destroy insects. You’re just trying to reduce the middle man, by being vegan. Animals, namely cattle, eat way more than even triple the food we do made from crops. Cut out the eating of the actual animal, and am extra 26 people could be fed from that grain and then if we stopped breeding them, they’re numbers would reduce. The Argentinian man makes no sense to me.

  199. Mariqn Todorov January 30, 2017 at 6:53 pm - Reply

    Vegans always have to say they are vegans keep it to yourself ! If you are a vegan I’m not interested and no one else is! Just to let u know

  200. Bernadette Kuhns January 30, 2017 at 6:57 pm - Reply

    As a person with an enemy called INTRACTABLE PAIN. ..meat carries the highest concentration of the element SELENIUM. Which reduces pain. In fact if you have pain you are depleted of this element. It comes from the earth and it is in most everything we eat at different percentages …to get enough of it from other foods one would need to consume so much extra weight would result. 🙂

  201. Caroline Maners January 30, 2017 at 6:58 pm - Reply

    You do realize the leading cause of climate change is actually animal agriculture?! I feel this person is just trying to justify eating corpses

  202. Zoe Douglas January 30, 2017 at 7:00 pm - Reply

    There will be no loss of forests if we used animal farming land for vegetable farming, less land is required. There are such things as nets too, like orchards use. I think this article is very one sided and not from a holistic view but a very personal view of just what they’ve seen not researched

  203. Danielle Mukash January 30, 2017 at 7:00 pm - Reply

    Their is no easy solutions to this dilemma. Everything is alive, from lettuce to cows to oranges to wheat. The difference is in the way you honor and respect you source of food.

  204. Brittany Erickson January 30, 2017 at 7:00 pm - Reply

    Stefany interesting viewpoint

  205. Praveen Aggarwal January 30, 2017 at 7:01 pm - Reply

    We have enough to feed the world but not for greed.

  206. Wyktor Paul January 30, 2017 at 7:02 pm - Reply

    Vegetarian is an old Indian word meaning fuckin’ terrible hunter

  207. Cristian Rival January 30, 2017 at 7:05 pm - Reply

    Totally true!!!

  208. Emily Bartlett January 30, 2017 at 7:08 pm - Reply

    Yes- except over half of corn crops is used for the use of ethanol and animal feed lol

  209. Luke Siekris January 30, 2017 at 7:14 pm - Reply

    Amanda Abergel food for thought

    • Amanda Abergel January 30, 2017 at 9:10 pm - Reply

      Thanks! yes! its important to be aware of animal products too. I still have leather stuff either but haven’t purchased any new. Also a lot of products & foods contribute to animal cruelty including “fake” leather and stuff like that. I try to be as aware as possible and research companies I buy from now. I am not completely vegan yet but I do fully support it and is my aim 🙂 My main this is just that we need to be aware of where our money goes and the products/ companies we are supporting. I’m not perfect 🙂 I just don’t want to participate / contribute to these industries anymore if I can avoid it I will. My car still has leather seats too. bought it before the no meat thing. It’s been a process 🙂 thanks for your support !

    • Amanda Abergel January 30, 2017 at 9:11 pm - Reply

      Also Luke Siekris I love articles like this! perspective. But I’m more focused on factory farming of animals, and its processes in the MASSES. trust me lol it makes a big difference – buying power 🙂 consumer power !

  210. Adam Biggs January 30, 2017 at 7:21 pm - Reply

    Apparently you can say anything you like, follow it up with a bunch of nonsense, and not expect to be called out for shitty journalism? Dumbest thing ever. It takes at least 7 times the grain to to get an equal quantity of meat.

  211. Shelby Lynn January 30, 2017 at 7:24 pm - Reply

    Becca Spence guess we just have to stop eating PERIOD dammit

  212. Denise Ives January 30, 2017 at 7:25 pm - Reply

    Interesting…

  213. Cedric van Bommel January 30, 2017 at 7:38 pm - Reply

    Omg this is so stupid it hurts

  214. Simon Currin January 30, 2017 at 7:40 pm - Reply

    Did you read the full article Kyle Webb?

  215. Lucy Calafato January 30, 2017 at 7:43 pm - Reply

    Possibly the most retarded thing I’ve ever read

  216. Lina Mukovozova January 30, 2017 at 7:47 pm - Reply

    “We are forcing nature to make room for crops” – YES, crops to use to feed slaughterhouse animals. If everyone was growing as much food for human consumption as mentioned in the article there would be significant reduction in starvation.

  217. Richard Barber January 30, 2017 at 7:47 pm - Reply

    As an ex farmer I can see his point. Modern mono cropping creates fields like dysfunctional deserts, no other life than the ones we want. As I can see from some of the comments there are some people who don’t run on fact or reason, just emotion.

  218. Payton Webb January 30, 2017 at 7:48 pm - Reply

    Wow. For people that only eat salad.. you guys are salty..

  219. Dean Shaun Marsh January 30, 2017 at 7:52 pm - Reply

    I whole heartedly agree with the logic and theory but it avoids the major issue in eating animals – the ethical treatment of animals. I personally eat no vegetables and have a largely meat based diet. I have no issue with eating an animal, it’s life and death, it’s the circle of life goddamn it, but there is absolutely no reason that animal should suffer!! Some of its horrific!! Whether you eat meat or vegetables is not the issue if your going to rear animals for slaughter you don’t have to make them suffer? And why do they? Money!!! Well put the price of meat up n look after your livestock! Simple!

  220. Darren James Hall January 30, 2017 at 7:55 pm - Reply

    If nobody ate meat, more land would be given over to growing crops, farmers would see no need to raise animals so would not give them grazing room, very few would survive

  221. Curtis Priddy January 30, 2017 at 10:59 pm - Reply

    Lolololol Argentina? Corrupt country and one of the biggest benefactors of the castle industry.

  222. Rachel Iwanski January 30, 2017 at 8:03 pm - Reply

    I’ve read this before. I totally understand the point he’s making but also it doesn’t change the fact that I would rather not eat dead animals lol

  223. Tracy Channer January 30, 2017 at 8:06 pm - Reply

    Don’t eat wheat and corn products….eat fresh organic produce as local as possible

  224. Ariel Hulsey January 30, 2017 at 8:07 pm - Reply

    That argument is not logical because farmed animals consume much more plants and grains then humans. If everyone were vegan there would be much less need for fields to take rainforest because all the vegetables and grains would go directly to feeding people. Not to mention the water that livestock consume on factory farms. To say nothing of the suffering factory farmed animals endure. I am confident my choice to go vegan is the right one for the environment, animals, humans, and my health and conscience.

  225. David Vella January 30, 2017 at 8:08 pm - Reply

    Thats y i choose voleterley not to eat animals 🙂

  226. Daisy Allsorts January 30, 2017 at 8:12 pm - Reply

    Whether we are meat eater or vegetarian we are all influencing number of animal wildlife and environment being destroyed directly or indirectly. I do not see point in arguing who contributing less or more to the issue.

  227. Hannah Waterfall January 30, 2017 at 8:12 pm - Reply

    Don’t post things about how to make the world more peaceful, then post pro-meat eating shit…There is nothing peaceful about the unnecessary death of 60 billion innocent beings every year. At least vegans are trying their best to make the world more peaceful.

  228. Ku Sum January 30, 2017 at 8:13 pm - Reply

    This is the dumbest thing ever. Tag kiya b to kaise

  229. Ben Dorsey January 30, 2017 at 8:13 pm - Reply

    This is a silly, irrational argument meant to make those who eat me feel a little less guilty about it. There is no research presented and no claims in his statement that couldn’t be easily dismantled with just a smidgen of research. Why share a post like this with no real content? Pointless, useless, and pathetic “share”.

  230. Katherine Smith January 30, 2017 at 8:15 pm - Reply

    We’ll sort of what I said but he did it in a far more journalistically well written manner

  231. Dave Bowden January 30, 2017 at 8:15 pm - Reply

    70 million cows being slaughtered every year and their blood being drained into the earth….is better than lettuce?

  232. Shelley Spann Glenney January 30, 2017 at 8:26 pm - Reply

    OMG now we can’t eat vegetable now!!!!

  233. Amanda Jane January 30, 2017 at 8:27 pm - Reply

    I’m vegetarian. (Not vegan) I see the point this dude is trying to make… however his logic is flawed in many ways. Also, Regardless of what you’re eating you’re causing harm or death to some sort of life form. Plants and fungus may not communicate on the same… let’s say, wavelength as humans but that doesn’t mean they don’t have “feelings” or “senses” we just lack the proper organs or cells to understand their communications.
    We connect with seeing cows and pigs and foxes crying and screaming and bleeding because we do the same… and it is absolutely heart wrenching for me, personally to see that kind of suffering and know that it exists. So I choose not to eat meat. I am aware that I cannot stop it entirely and that the life cycle exists and works (in the natural world at least).
    It’s obvious that no one can prevent ALL suffering. I mean… how would the wild and domestic predators eat?! It makes no sense to think in those terms.
    However, I do believe we as humans, sentient omnivores and also apex predators, have a choice. With that choice comes responsibility. To the rest of our planet, to all life and to ourselves. We need to maintain a balance.
    Moderation is key and at the point we’re at as a species, we truly need to tip the scales in the opposite direction. Heavily. Human greed is causing massive destruction and an imbalance. Eventually something will “cull the herd” so to speak… We tend to think we’re above everything. We’re not. Remember Ebola? It evolved for a reason. J/S.

  234. Jeremy Thomas January 30, 2017 at 8:30 pm - Reply

    Richie Thomas look at all those animals you are killing by not eating meat. Go back and eat a steak to save a bird.

    • Richie Thomas January 30, 2017 at 8:58 pm - Reply

      What a stupid argument. Yeah of course animals will die when growing crops but 80% of all the world’s crops are fed to farmed animals. So if you don’t support that you’re killing a far less number.

  235. Christina Nasic January 30, 2017 at 8:35 pm - Reply

    This is ridiculous. Ofcourse uneducated misinformed and mentally challenged greedy carnivorous would jump on this one! Pffft . people who are this set in their ways unable to see beyond the actual truth and facts are just too much for me. Connie Fuentealba

    • Connie Fuentealba January 30, 2017 at 8:48 pm - Reply

      This is the most stupid thing I’ve
      ever read. The plantation of those corps of corn and all that is basically to feed the live stock of the meat industry which yes its destroying the environment. If we all humans have a plant base diet we wouldn’t even need to eat half of the plantations that they use to feed the animal. This post is so misinformation and a lot of people will fall for this.

    • Christina Nasic January 30, 2017 at 8:50 pm - Reply

      I know thats what pisses me off. But honestly the only people who would are the ones who can’t stand to admit they are destroying the planet and killing sentient beings. Blah sickness!

    • Connie Fuentealba January 30, 2017 at 9:00 pm - Reply

      True

  236. Chris Luke January 30, 2017 at 8:44 pm - Reply

    Ian Anderson hahaha vegan would say do your research

  237. Callie Summerlin January 30, 2017 at 8:45 pm - Reply

    This is a little out there and extreme.

  238. Allyson Gowen January 30, 2017 at 8:46 pm - Reply

    nevet thought about it like that!!
    Rhonda Dankel Gowen

  239. Hannah Batt January 30, 2017 at 8:48 pm - Reply

    The nets they use in orchards do keep most animals out but large numbers of birds, rabbits etc get in. A large part of orchard work is killing birds and rabbits etc. Specifically pushing baby birds and nests out of trees and hanging up mist nets that ensnare birds and leave them to die. The main focus is the quality of the fruit above all else. Not disagreeing with the argument, just pointing out that orchards are very much the types of agriculture he is talking about.

  240. Paweł Ługowski January 30, 2017 at 8:52 pm - Reply

    as a lot of ppl pointed out there – and I am suprised it was not mentioned in article – animals eat plants too! if you eat animals there is still need for cultivated plants they will eat, so if all had been eating meat only we would have even more areas for growing plants to feed animals.

  241. Rich Rowland January 30, 2017 at 8:55 pm - Reply

    cattle production is way down as people eat less and less red meat

  242. Pater Noiser January 30, 2017 at 8:59 pm - Reply

    time to eat argentinian naturalists

  243. Thomas Blas January 30, 2017 at 9:03 pm - Reply

    Exactly, not everyone is delusional, just trying to help as much as possible

  244. Gerard Dougherty January 30, 2017 at 9:11 pm - Reply

    There needs to be a major change globaly around farming in general.land needs to be used more efficiently. In your example of rabbits tbh they are an invasive species and effort must be spent to remove them from our country…. perhaps one day along side free range there will be a “low impact source” sticker showing tat the agricultural ethod used was as ecological as possible

  245. Myriam Ephrem January 30, 2017 at 9:16 pm - Reply

    Wow I never thought about this. Thank you for sharing. I’ll read more about the matter though since it’s called for. More evidence and proof.

    Nevertheless, I personally don’t believe the killing of animals will diminish if I don’t eat them, same with plant cultivated fields. So I already gave up on the fact that humans including myself will stop harming animals, whether domestic or wildlife animals, though I still don’t want to eat them – the reasons got more personal and psychological here (will tell you why later).

  246. Daniel T. McCaffery January 30, 2017 at 9:18 pm - Reply

    You just cannot win.

  247. Karla Thompson January 30, 2017 at 9:18 pm - Reply

    The average domestic animal eats much much more plant material than the average human. If all domestic animals bred for consumption were suddenly gone, I don’t know how much more or less farm land would be needed to fill the equivalent consumption needs of the meat that was being eaten. So, it is hard to judge how accurate this statement is.
    Vegans are aware eating plants kills animals as well. Do we like it? No, but we do have to eat something.
    The problem is overpopulation of humans. Less humans taxing the resources of the planet means less land needed to feed them all.
    Also, farmers should be willing to share part of their yield with the animals who visit their fields, but that is radical talk and would be laughed at.
    Thank you for sharing this.

  248. Billy Sayer January 30, 2017 at 9:19 pm - Reply

    I think Bertonatti is getting confused with the general impact global population growth has.

  249. Julie Collins January 30, 2017 at 9:26 pm - Reply

    And look at the comments
    …..
    Everyone arguing

    Will
    We ever come together?
    Even faced with trump
    All we can do is vent our spleen on social networks.
    God what a sad pathetic existence we have now.
    Well done Zuckerberg
    You prick

  250. Rhonda Dankel Gowen January 30, 2017 at 9:30 pm - Reply

    My issue is the suffering the animals endure. The way they’re raised and treated on the farms. I understand everything is connected.

  251. Joan Williams January 30, 2017 at 9:32 pm - Reply

    Circle of Life – Some1 watched Lion King!

  252. Wendy Margaret Trent January 30, 2017 at 9:37 pm - Reply

    What a pathetic, poorly reasoned article. This Argentinian has the reasoning ability of a village idiot. Being vegan is an attempt to minimise the suffering of sentient beings and a refusal to participate in the obscenity of breeding and killing 70 billion land animals per year globally (this staggering figure does not even take into account the billions of fish and other marine animals who are slaughtered each year for the palate pleasure of humans). Veganism is the choice to live mindfully and consciously, and to live in a way that recognises the sacredness of all life. Yes, we eat plants, because we have to eat. But there is no greater consumer of planted crops and the planet’s water resources than animal agriculture. Plant foods that could feed the starving people of the world are used to raise defenceless, vulnerable, sentient beings to be killed for the palate pleasure of privileged, entitled first world countries. The Amazon Forest is being destroyed at a rate of more than 5 rugby fields per day to make grazing land for ANIMAL AGRICULTURE!!! And it takes 2000 gallons of water to produce 1 pound of meat. Man’s addiction to flesh eating not only destroys 70 billion innocent lives per year, it destroys our ancient forests, our oceans and our planet.

  253. Francesco Cachia Caruana January 30, 2017 at 9:38 pm - Reply

    Do you know vegetations are just as bad as meat eater for one plants have been proven to they feel pain can be effected by anaesthetic and they effect by people emotions. In short vegetations would rather kill an creature with no face cause it’s easier.

  254. Alex Hebl January 31, 2017 at 12:41 am - Reply

    Did you read this?

  255. Josh Foster January 30, 2017 at 9:42 pm - Reply

    Leo Dillon you read the article right? His claim is that the land that we use for agricultural purposes is leading to deforestation and in turn the killing of those wild animals, you do know that roughly 66% of that land is used solely for growing feed for domesticated livestock and comparatively humans use about 8% of agricultural land for direct consumption. Also just because, the interviewer is the director of an exotic leather and luxurious goods company, there’s your bias. This is what’s called misinformation being used to cause confusion. Do me a favour and grab that cactus again, you know what to do.

    • Leo Dillon January 30, 2017 at 10:09 pm - Reply

      If you knew me at all you’d know I could actually care less about any of this shit……eat meat, don’t eat meat, doesn’t affect me either way.

    • Leo Dillon January 30, 2017 at 10:12 pm - Reply

      For the record, I LOVE steak and exotic leather goods…..

    • Josh Foster January 30, 2017 at 10:17 pm - Reply

      Oh I figured, you’re a smart guy, I got partway through writing that and was like, perfect way to reintroduce the cactus. For the record, everyone knows about your leather fetish and exotic dildo collection.

    • Leo Dillon January 30, 2017 at 10:18 pm - Reply

      is nothing sacred!?!?!

  256. Anthony Sheffield January 31, 2017 at 12:43 am - Reply

    Eat what you want and shut up. Unless you grow your own food and raise your own livestock you really can’t say shit that matters to each other.

  257. Eline Tan January 30, 2017 at 9:43 pm - Reply

    This is scary, triggered vegans are on rampage.

  258. Alex Hebl January 31, 2017 at 12:44 am - Reply

    I think the logic is flawed personally .

  259. Desiree Tabbers January 30, 2017 at 9:45 pm - Reply

    But I don’t eat wheat, so how am I killing of wildlife ?

  260. Christian Guthrie January 30, 2017 at 9:45 pm - Reply

    What if plants feel pain?

  261. Alex Hebl January 31, 2017 at 12:53 am - Reply

    Matt Tholen yes also vegans eat like 1/10 of what animals like cows eat

  262. Tiago Marques January 30, 2017 at 10:00 pm - Reply

    Not many valid points in the article. I love animals but first of all I use common sense when it comes to what I shove down my body: meats and animal related food takes for us humans to process way longer than vegetables, Its not that we are pure vegetarians by nature but our system does process vegetables in a more natural and quicker way than meat.

  263. Ashley Courtney January 30, 2017 at 10:04 pm - Reply

    Read this Jamie Nay short read but what do you think?

    • Jamie Nay January 30, 2017 at 10:15 pm - Reply

      A very exaggerated way of looking at it but i guess its right, the survival of one thing does in almost all cases relie on the death of another “circle of life kinda thing” although i guess most vegies make that choice to stop the suffering of animals which if everyone was vegie it would largly reduce animal suffering, but not necessa4ly death. I cant see the point in being vegie for that reason tho coz either way someones gunna eat the meat and if it gives you nutrition you need then i guess by natural selection you take it.. Such is life

  264. Kylie Johns January 30, 2017 at 10:05 pm - Reply

    Interesting concept

  265. Xenia Mastoraki January 30, 2017 at 10:05 pm - Reply

    Whatever

  266. Gilbert Maines January 31, 2017 at 1:06 am - Reply

    Those who want to protect animals, only want to protect some animals and not others. Animals with too many legs (octopus, centipede, shrimp, etc) and animals with too few legs (conch, eel, snake, etc) should die. Well, in some cases “should die” is too strong. But if these wrong legged living things eat your preferred plants, instant chemical weapons should be used for mass extermination. Worms, caterpillars, slugs, ants and in many cases larger: mice, squirrels, rabbits, coyotes, bears and others should die. This inconsistency is forgiven because they are sensitive sometimes to some species.

  267. Taylor Britt January 30, 2017 at 10:16 pm - Reply

    I can see both views. Though I feel further reasearch should be done. As well as was this one farm? I don’t like factory farming and the amount of water that goes into factory farming and transportation and gmos. All of it costs so much money and pollutes our system. Obviously this isn’t a perfect world so yes I see where animals may die but if I can contribute to less mass slaughter then by all means no meat for me. Also my body doesn’t want it any more.

  268. Tina Wulfhelmet January 30, 2017 at 10:26 pm - Reply

    Really, the issue is that meat is irresponsibly produced and the whole process isn’t sustainable.. the no-meat movement is really about earth, not about the cute little bunny .

  269. Dean Baldry January 30, 2017 at 10:27 pm - Reply

    Wow! It’s just something for your bias brain to think about.. No need to get aggressive

  270. Dean Baldry January 30, 2017 at 10:34 pm - Reply

    The less people on this planet, the less animals get slaughtered. Pretty simple don’t you think?

  271. Hayley Pinsent January 30, 2017 at 10:39 pm - Reply

    Aww love you too

  272. Karelle Garden January 30, 2017 at 10:39 pm - Reply

    Lets just eat nothing at all

  273. Jim Russel Ong January 30, 2017 at 10:42 pm - Reply

    Fishing for vegans………

  274. Morgan Miles January 30, 2017 at 10:48 pm - Reply

    This is completely ridiculous and false. Do you know how many grains go to domestic animals in farm factories? And how much water is consumed by them? And how much methane is released? This page should not have posted such bs that will deter more people from the meat free lifestyle that would help the environment’S health and their own health.

  275. Tracy Perry January 30, 2017 at 10:51 pm - Reply

    Mmmmmm…. food for thought Lydia Brown

    • Lydia Brown January 31, 2017 at 8:57 am - Reply

      Guess you cant win… Thats it… Time for the dust diet 😉

  276. Melanie Reed January 30, 2017 at 10:53 pm - Reply

    A billion animals are killed annually to feed meat eaters. What do you think those animals eat? This article is fundamentally flawed.

  277. Melissa Payne Luxmoore January 30, 2017 at 10:54 pm - Reply

    Karla I definitely think the bigger issue is the clearing of forests for agriculture, be it for non-meat crops or to create grazing land for our herbivores destined for consumption. We’re damaging our atmosphere and wiping out whole populations of species. Your point of overpopulation is the root issue of course, and as our world populations continue to grow unchecked, this problem will become even more pervasive than it already is We’re all culpable for sure.

  278. Aaron Jamery January 30, 2017 at 10:55 pm - Reply

    Michelle Sanders Frizzell interesting read.

  279. Alice Lizarraga January 30, 2017 at 10:58 pm - Reply

    Ridiculous post. At least theyre trying to make a difference for others even animals. Most people live without thinking of how their choices affect the lives of others. Those researchers should put their brains to better use.

  280. Ivonne Pohlman January 30, 2017 at 11:00 pm - Reply

    He’s an idiot #primitive

  281. Ben de Riter January 30, 2017 at 11:01 pm - Reply

    Come on mate, you’re better than this!

  282. Jeffrey D'Mello January 30, 2017 at 11:02 pm - Reply

    The only thing I’m better than is 1000m in less than 180 seconds.

  283. Heather Harmon January 30, 2017 at 11:03 pm - Reply

    Don’t overthink this… every little bit of compassion for animals helps this world to be a better place … surely

  284. Rhiannon Cousens January 30, 2017 at 11:12 pm - Reply

    Just don’t get why we don’t eat all the crops we feed the cows etc… #ditchmeat #saveouroxygen

  285. James Wills January 30, 2017 at 11:13 pm - Reply

    I didnt read it but i thought u might like to educate urself

  286. Maureen Keller January 30, 2017 at 11:22 pm - Reply

    Haaaahahaha

  287. Barry Sutherland January 30, 2017 at 11:29 pm - Reply

    Questionable

  288. Ben Bellante January 30, 2017 at 11:35 pm - Reply

    Lmao. Angry vegetarians everywhere

  289. Natasha Cocks January 30, 2017 at 11:36 pm - Reply

    PETA Australia see if this makes sense to you guys now as I’ve left a few comments on your go vegan campaigns about this very prospect. This guy turned vegetarian in teenage years to HELP animals but later found he was only helping animals in farming not wild by his choice

  290. Saray Diez January 30, 2017 at 11:41 pm - Reply

    Yeah, fair enough, anything related to mass production is not sustainable but that’s why we should embrace forest gardens and a natural approach to food consumption. Permaculture is the answer. Still believe a vegan opt is better than the omnivore way though (for innumerable reasons) Peace and V

  291. Raquel Baglino January 30, 2017 at 11:42 pm - Reply

    Wow

  292. Kimberley Bargache January 30, 2017 at 11:49 pm - Reply

    I have been researching a lot to, here is a simple picture to show what I found on the agricultural side of things…
    This shows how much land is needed to supply a year’s worth of food for a family.. the first smallest box is for Vegans, Second one is for the vegetarians and the two last ones are just for omnivores..

  293. Jeff Griffin January 30, 2017 at 11:50 pm - Reply

    Seems to me if people would just grow their own food we would have less issues.

  294. Jared Pecotich January 30, 2017 at 11:52 pm - Reply

    Save the animals from a slow death of malnutrition and starvation. Eat them quickly

  295. Paul Matevicius January 30, 2017 at 11:54 pm - Reply

    Well, all are right in their opinion and observation in this world. Putting however most of the attention of the production of foods like corn solely on vegetarians and vegans? Hmm. Also, just to add, a lot of communities grown their own crops and live off those, it’s not like all veggies and vegans (#vgang) rely on the food system that encourages more rainforests to be destroyed. This article is quite a stretch

  296. Izak White January 30, 2017 at 11:58 pm - Reply

    Izzie Edwards gotta stay up to date yall

  297. Allen Moosakhanian January 30, 2017 at 11:59 pm - Reply

    Ejmin Gharibian what are your thoughts on this???

  298. Leonard Scully January 31, 2017 at 12:01 am - Reply

    Oh no the truth hurts vegans denial.

  299. Linda Skrgatic January 31, 2017 at 12:09 am - Reply

    Argentinian naturalist trying to justify the excessive daily meat bbqs they have over there! It’s all meat meat meat asados, culture built around it. Why did you post this silly perspective he’s not even correct. Don’t waste people’s time.

  300. Lily Pilly January 31, 2017 at 12:09 am - Reply

    Who cares about the argument over eating meat and byproducts of animals or not. It’s “sustainability” that counts. A lot of vege types have no clue that their diet also contributes to the destruction of the environment via monoculture, fertilizers and it’s run off into waterways, and the amount of petrochemical based transport and mechanization required to keep humans fed. A good vegetarian/vegan who cares about environmental impacts should eat locally and sustainably, grow as much food themselves as they can (even apartment dwellers have done this) and learn about permaculture and FOOD FORESTS as the way to provide optimum nutrition while providing good stewardship of the planet’s resources. Just not eating meat is paying lip service to environmentalism and ethics. Read Bill Mollison, Masanobu Fukuoka, David Holmgren.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permaculture

  301. Em Bem January 31, 2017 at 12:17 am - Reply

    Cycle of life, all omnivores eat meat and plants. You ever see a dog eating a salad? Just be conscious about how much and where the meat and veg is sourced. Gmos are also doing a lot if damage to humans, wildlife and environment and they’re plants

  302. Denise Clark January 31, 2017 at 12:18 am - Reply

    Meat eaters will do or say anything to justify their disgusting habit, just like smokers, alcoholics and drug addicts. Eating meat not only causes suffering to animals, but causes disease and suffering to humans as well. I think deep down we all know this. Like they really care about wildlife. Sure.

  303. David Alan Stanke January 31, 2017 at 12:25 am - Reply

    This article has “Straw Man” written all over it. If I were to argue that 80 percent of deforestation in the Amazon rainforest is due to an increase in raising cattle for human consumption and the reply was, “well, you vegans eat wheat and corn and doing so forces nature to make room for those crops – which in turn can destabilize animal habitats…so there.” Research has shown that of all the agricultural land in the U.S., 80% is used to raise animals for food and grow grain to feed them. You could feed every living person on the planet with the amount of food which is produced for factory farms. But let’s focus on the “perceived misconceptions” of those vegans and vegetarians among us. The Mind Unleashed – If you talk with the majority of vegans/vegetarians, they are well informed on the issues and have made the choice to LIMIT the amount of unnecessary suffering in this world.

  304. James D Xii January 31, 2017 at 12:28 am - Reply

    Checkmate vegans

  305. Ethan Coronado January 31, 2017 at 12:31 am - Reply

    Meat is so yummy though I’d shoot a deer infront of its deer wife if I was hungry enough

  306. Polly Pissy Pants January 31, 2017 at 12:36 am - Reply

    What about the deforestation to make way for cattle grazing hundreds and hundreds of hectares of the Amazon have been destroyed for this purpose

  307. Nikki NG January 31, 2017 at 12:38 am - Reply

    Lolllll this is dumb …. The only example he had was birds been scared off and most crops r grown to feed cattle and than they torchered and killed so it’s double the damage lol. Sounds like my dad wrote that argument for an excuse to eat meat haha

  308. Italia Millán January 31, 2017 at 12:42 am - Reply

    “Ranching-induced deforestation is one of the main causes of loss of some unique plant and animal species in the tropical rainforests of Central and South America as well as carbon release in the atmosphere,” said Henning Steinfeld, Chief of the FAO Livestock Information, Sector Analysis and Policy Branch.
    http://www.fao.org/newsroom/en/news/2005/102924/index.html

  309. Matt Tholen January 31, 2017 at 12:43 am - Reply

    Yes

  310. Damien Boase January 31, 2017 at 12:44 am - Reply

    Probably written by someone in the cattle industry hahaha

  311. Italia Millán January 31, 2017 at 12:45 am - Reply

    “Diets rich in beef and other red meat can be bad for a person’s health. And the practice is equally bad for Earth’s biodiversity, according to a team of scientists who have fingered human carnivory—and its impact on land use—as the single biggest threat to much of the world’s flora and fauna.”
    http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2015/08/meat-eaters-may-speed-worldwide-species-extinction-study-warns

  312. Karen Swanepoel January 31, 2017 at 12:45 am - Reply

    I agree with Sandra Lee. There should be population control. There are too many humans on the planet.

  313. Benjamin Silva January 31, 2017 at 12:46 am - Reply

    Hes not entirely wrong :3

  314. Matt Tholen January 31, 2017 at 12:51 am - Reply

    yes it is because we need more farm land because of the growing population not vegans

  315. Matt Tholen January 31, 2017 at 12:53 am - Reply

    if only cows were carnivores

  316. Italia Millán January 31, 2017 at 12:54 am - Reply

    “Producing crops (soy, corn, wheat, etc.) for animal feed is many times more resource-intensive than using crops for direct human consumption. While there are perilous trade-offs related to fuel vs. food, a more serious concern for a variety of reasons is feed vs. food.

    With 75% of all agricultural land used for animal production—and more than a third of global calories and half of global protein inefficiently used as animal feed —the impact of increasing global meat consumption is monumental.”
    http://awfw.org/feed-ratios/

  317. Amish Hussein Makina January 31, 2017 at 12:57 am - Reply

    I just had goat meat and I’m not even sorry!

  318. Jerline Nancy January 31, 2017 at 1:10 am - Reply

    I used to be a Non veg lover and can eat almost anything but this one not in favour of animals just for your own good http://www.celestialhealing.net/physicalveg3.htm

  319. Chen Gui January 31, 2017 at 1:11 am - Reply

    the time for hunter/gatherer revival IS NEAR!!!! AHAHAHA SERIOUSLY GUYZ

  320. Alexandre Banville January 31, 2017 at 1:20 am - Reply

    Michel Khoury, I didnt read the article, but the title in enough for me;) should I tag Noémie ?

  321. Minwoo Youn January 31, 2017 at 1:22 am - Reply

    Plants feel pain and has ability to remember like many other living things on earth.

    I believe every living thing has a spirit including trees and plants.
    At the end of the day, us humans have to consume living things to exist.

    As much as i love animals and plants we cant just live on water.

    We have to do our part by preserving the planet and its species but unfortunately we have to eat as well.

    I think it’s balance that we are lacking.

    Not enough love and sincerity and too much greed.

    • Sam Adisa February 1, 2017 at 1:48 pm - Reply

      Yeah we have concrete evidence that plants aren’t self aware. This pseudo-esotertic nonsense that flies in the face of documented science really pissed me off

    • Minwoo Youn February 1, 2017 at 2:08 pm - Reply

      Sam Adisa they are still living things aren’t they? If they feel pain and has memory wouldn’t you think they are self aware in some kind of form ? Just because we don’t understand something does not mean its all nonsense somethings can not be explained with our understanding of the universe. Its all science. Science we don’t yet fully understand. I believe spiritual stuff and science are closely related

  322. Cady Gierke January 31, 2017 at 1:25 am - Reply

    The forests are being cut down for livestock!!! The more livestock needed, the more forests are being cleared! The more meat eaters means more livestock. I’d rather clear small patches for gardens than huge patches for livestock.

  323. Stacey McCausland January 31, 2017 at 1:29 am - Reply

    Dumb argument. We use more land to graze cattle and grow feed for them than we would use to grow crops to feed humans.

  324. Sarah Gould January 31, 2017 at 1:30 am - Reply

    Plants are living.. So your killing living things for you own profit whether it’s a “meat product” or a plant.

  325. Daniel Winsor January 31, 2017 at 1:42 am - Reply

    Exactly what so many above have said. More monocrops are grown for livestock than humans could ever possibly consume. If less livestock existed, so would less monocrops like soy and corn, and therefore less wild animals would die.
    Yet again seeing twisted facts come out of what SHOULD be a reputable source but really just a puppet for an industry based on death and defilement.

  326. Ricardo Acevedo January 31, 2017 at 1:43 am - Reply

    LMAOOOO loss of forests ?!? Really ?! since when do humans eat leaves grass or trees ? Dude whoever made this article is either a complete moron or a fraud on so many levels. Not to mention this planet has more green resources than anything on this planet so I find it pretty ridiculous for someone to believe that we aren’t doing animals any good because on the contrary, we aren’t the ones contributing to their pain and suffering. And frankly considering how many of us vegans and vegetarians there are around the world, we are without a doubt making one hell of a difference even if the ignorant omnivores don’t see it

  327. Briana Broderick January 31, 2017 at 1:49 am - Reply

    An absolutely ridiculous article. Thousands of acres of wild terrain such as the amazon is flattened to create space for cattle. And much of the land that is destroyed to farm grain is grain strictly to feed cattle. This article supports non truths and empty points. This is very disappointing.

  328. Lawrence Patrick Singson January 31, 2017 at 1:54 am - Reply

    And of course we have to hear this from an Argentinian.

  329. Roxanne Elizabeth January 31, 2017 at 2:20 am - Reply

    Whatever helps them sleep at night I guess

  330. Calum Davidson January 31, 2017 at 5:33 am - Reply

    I think what the man is trying to say is if for the sake of animal welfare, you are a vegan, the only way you are going to not be in any way harming animals is to neck out so I don’t have to listen to your holier than thou bullshit while im enjoying my deluxe rib eye steak!

  331. Nara Baudelaire January 31, 2017 at 2:41 am - Reply

    Why are you vegetarians trying to guilt omnivores out of being omnivores.
    If you can go against human nature, that’s cool, but it’s scientifically proven that we wouldn’t be as awesome as we are (evelutionary) if we had not been eating meat).
    If you want to argue science with feelings, you’re as bad as the religious.

  332. Susan Cole January 31, 2017 at 2:54 am - Reply

    Bertonatti’s simplistic view does not account for growing all that grain to feed the huge population of livestock. His argument that in nature survival depends on the death of others does not define what is nature. As Colleen Patrick-Goudreau put it: Bringing animals into the world only to kill them is not part of the ‘cycle of nature.’ We artificially inseminate animals, kill them years before their life span is up, then justify it as ‘natural’, comparing ourselves to other animals who kill to survive’. Last time I looked, lions weren’t breeding gazelles.

  333. Ela Gryz January 31, 2017 at 3:03 am - Reply

    Given there is 5 times more animals than people and that they also eat plant produce his arguments do not hold it. It is not vegetarians who contribute to the current state of deforestation and loss of wild life, it is actually meat lovers that do that, we feed the animals that feed us

  334. Teresa Folds January 31, 2017 at 3:18 am - Reply

    Alternative facts coming from a country that idolizes the consumption of meat. Should I be surprised? Nope!

    One day, humans will look upon the torture and murder of animals as vile and abhorrent. Many do now. They reject the status quo and the blind participation in the murder of animals and they thrive.

    Eating the rotting flesh of animals is the cause of much suffering and disease in humans. One should not eat anything that causes disease.

  335. Anna Gaukrodger January 31, 2017 at 3:19 am - Reply

    Andygirl Elbe Interesting Read! Yes read it all!

    • Andygirl Elbe January 31, 2017 at 5:58 am - Reply

      I did. And yes in order to do no harm whatsoever I would have to be dead…
      The amount of plant based food humans would need to grow if we didn’t eat meat is far less however to the amount needed to be grown for animal feed… to grow meat…
      I challenge you to watch Forks over Knives and Cowspiracy…

  336. Thomas Thompson January 31, 2017 at 3:24 am - Reply

    6 padics of grain to feed 1 padic cows haven’t eaten meat for 42 years now 60 no health problems still like killing non natives

  337. Glenn Gilmore January 31, 2017 at 3:27 am - Reply

    That’s the most ridiculous proposition ever. If you do eat meat you clear far more land than needed to grow plants to get that meat.

    • Matt Fj January 31, 2017 at 3:34 am - Reply

      In Nz yes. Every where else grow grain by the mile to feed crate / prison kept animals it!!..no win situation! !!

    • Glenn Gilmore January 31, 2017 at 5:26 am - Reply

      You sill have to clear more acreage to grow enough grain for a cow compared to if it were used to just grow for humans directly.

    • Matt Fj January 31, 2017 at 5:28 am - Reply

      I’m feeling ya!!!

  338. Jason Brooks January 31, 2017 at 3:32 am - Reply

    Hahahaha and the vegans will never talk about over harvested wild edibles, the extinct or near extinct species of plants and fungi. They’ll never realize or admit a plant or fungi is just as much a cognizant or communal being as animal or human which has been proven. They’ll never admit it’s just as much a fad as many of the trendy diet claims. They’ll claim PETA is loving and innocent – when in reality they have been caught committing crimes against animals. Vegans are mostly people who won’t admit that man by nature is an omnivore for nutritional balance. Try selling you can survive in the wilderness on herbs, twigs and berries and every survivalist will laugh you into the ground.

  339. Casey Martin January 31, 2017 at 3:33 am - Reply

    Ok, but what if you grew your own garden and were a completely self-sustaining vegetarian?

  340. Xandd Tamling January 31, 2017 at 3:41 am - Reply

    I knewwwwwwwwwwww

  341. Donald Smart January 31, 2017 at 3:49 am - Reply

    So many people seemed to have missed the point. IF you are a vegetarian for the sole purpose of helping animals you are only helping the domesticated animals we eat. As the study shows a larger number and diversity of animals on say a cattle station as opposed to say a wheat farm. And in my view both are unnecessarily detrimental the the environment.
    As for the debate of should man eat meat i believe nature tells us all we need to know. The majority of food we get from plans is seasonal. So would not be readily available on a day to day basis. Thus the need for another abundant source of food (MEAT). Could be why as far as im aware no native peoples were vegetarian.

  342. Peter Webb January 31, 2017 at 6:52 am - Reply

    I see a fundamental misunderstanding of the livestock industry by many of those commenting here. It is that grain is the normal and necessary food of domestic animals.

    The reality is that the natural food of cattle and sheep is grass. On my property, every single sheep is eating grass. Over 90% of the sheep and cattle in Australia are pastured on grass, and the pastures that they graze are far more diverse and contain far more native species (both plant and animal) than grain fields in the same landscape.

    What the critics further ignore, is that animals can eat a great deal of plant material that humans cannot….. and farmers simply cannot grow 100% human-quality food the whole time.
    A spell of bad weather at harvest and the wheat that would have made your pasta or bread, is spoiled. If we cannot feed it to livestock, it must be wasted.
    The oil that you use in your salad and cooking is only a fraction of the plant that is grown to produce it. The straw and protein meal that remain are valuable by-products if fed to animals, but are wasted if they cannot be used for that purpose.
    We must rotate crops if we are to combat disease without using excessive chemicals, but not all alternative crops are something that you would want to eat.
    Pasture is actually the most sustainable and fertility-budding regime for soil…. growing vegetables or crops requires more tillage, more energy, more diesel and produces more erosion…… but you can’t eat it.

    Don’t talk about “research” without doing it yourself.

  343. Anne-Marie d'Vinichi January 31, 2017 at 4:06 am - Reply

    confusing past and poor agricultural habits with the questions in veganism is poor thinking at best and really not the standard of thinking I would demand of someone with such a reputation.

  344. James Thia January 31, 2017 at 4:18 am - Reply

    Maybe human should learn from buddha to eat 1 meal only (lesser meal)

  345. Andy Drew Randy Spencer January 31, 2017 at 4:22 am - Reply

    I live in a state that hunting and farming is BIG! In the summer the farmers take out more deer at night than the hunters ever thought of. They have to. A heard of deer will absolutely destroy a field of soy beans or corn or even cotton. This can devastate a farmers yield. Same goes for wild hogs.

  346. Cassandra Nevarez January 31, 2017 at 4:33 am - Reply

    Chad Rickman
    Instructor Andrew Serra
    I’ve never heard this point of view.

  347. Floki Chok Dee January 31, 2017 at 4:39 am - Reply

    1. Bulshit – for every cow we eat we need to take down much more forest space.
    2. PERMACULTURE – learn about it – https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permaculture

  348. Fonzo Rodriguez January 31, 2017 at 4:47 am - Reply

    But in school we learn well tought plants are living things

  349. Jonathan Rioux January 31, 2017 at 4:49 am - Reply

    You didn’t now corns has been killing savage fish in the forest for quite a while ?

  350. Douglas Talbott January 31, 2017 at 4:52 am - Reply

    Well you vegans would just have to keep up your abortion practice . Just a nother killing of life .

  351. Cameron Hayes January 31, 2017 at 4:53 am - Reply

    James Hunt time you stopped being vego

  352. Donna Setterberg January 31, 2017 at 4:57 am - Reply

    I’m running out of edible options.

  353. Tyler Houle January 31, 2017 at 5:08 am - Reply

    Jessica Bova this is whati was trying to say talking about vegatariens

  354. Deborah Jordan-Caldwell DeGrendele January 31, 2017 at 5:30 am - Reply

    Everything has a soul.

  355. Priscila Bizinelli January 31, 2017 at 5:32 am - Reply

    Dana Alyssa what’s your opinion about the article?

  356. Juan Cazorla January 31, 2017 at 5:33 am - Reply

    Wow, very interesting

  357. Liz Valadez January 31, 2017 at 5:36 am - Reply

    He is the one with a misconception. The cultivation of crops is mostly to feed animals nowadays, if we didn’t use it to feed animals we could easily eradicate starving ppl in the world. Watch Cowspiracy, it is explained in detail.

  358. Didee Higgins January 31, 2017 at 5:36 am - Reply

    Whatever this crap is
    It is an article made up and played for by the animal agriculture industry in attempts to justify destroying the planet
    Please educate yourself and realize it is wrong on every level to have animals BRED and killed

  359. SumanTh Nukul January 31, 2017 at 5:37 am - Reply

    Lol 😀 tel me how you eat meat without adding veggies to it

  360. Be Solomon January 31, 2017 at 5:49 am - Reply

    Just don’t eat. Simple. I heard they are making rice out of plastic these days in China.

  361. Raymond Powell January 31, 2017 at 6:03 am - Reply

    Far more land is used up to grow all the food for the animals that are then slaughtered. So this article is not quite right.

  362. Sara Lynn January 31, 2017 at 6:04 am - Reply

    Well what does he suggest we eat then? I’d still support the non eating of “domestic” animals- if you have ever seen a video inside a factory these animals are in misery their entire life. At least a wild animal was wild and experienced life. This article should not deter anyone from abstaining from meat. ✌

  363. Jessica Satori January 31, 2017 at 6:07 am - Reply

    A cow has to eat 14-16 pounds of grain to produce just one pound of meat for consumption. How many people can 1 pound of meat feed? And how many people can 16 pounds of grain feed? So one block of land harvesting crops would feed many more people than would the same size block harvesting cattle for meat production. Therefore, if more people became vegetarians or vegans, far less land would have to be farmed for production of food than if there existed no vegetarians or vegans at all, therefore contributing less not only to the killing of the otherwise farmed animals but also the wild ones. So although I do agree that wild animals die for farmed land, far fewer of them would have to do so if no-one ate meat or wore leather.

  364. Thalia Rose January 31, 2017 at 6:13 am - Reply

    Oh yeah and what about all the land it took to destroy to create miles and miles of cages for crowded cows I’ve seen in east California and Texas. Like I have cried from the 10 cows huddled in mud some laying on each other in a little metal box and there were hundreds of these little fenced in spaces crowding each other I don’t even understand how they got those cows in there it was so unimaginable….I can’t believe I have to explain….this article is crap, I would rather eat a plant then an animal that has a face and organs like me.

  365. B Nichole Hilliard January 31, 2017 at 6:18 am - Reply

    People dont realize that plants are Alive also. And are capable of suffering. They stay alive much longer than we do when they’re mutilated too. Some plants can be out od the round for days or weeks and still regrow. Showing fhey never died. They just sat slowly suffering to death

  366. Niamh Kehoe January 31, 2017 at 6:18 am - Reply

    Benny Keatley didn’t you say this?

  367. Yousaf Zaid January 31, 2017 at 6:28 am - Reply

    You mean kill the vegetarian and you will save birds?This may not be correct.I would amend your theory like this:Eat up all eggs so that nothing is left for hen to hatch.Introduce animal abortions so that animals don’t have babies for you to adopt,hug and suffer.

  368. Joe Gillespie January 31, 2017 at 6:29 am - Reply

    So grow your own food..

  369. Mudassir Ahmed January 31, 2017 at 6:34 am - Reply

    You can claim anything some will support and others may oppose.

    Do what suits best for you? you need something to eat to satiate the hunger be it plant, animals fruits etc etc.

    Think about people who doesnt have anything to eat. If you dont eat meat or veg donate.

    At the end of the day someone is fed something thats Humanity.

  370. Jœ G Brown January 31, 2017 at 6:43 am - Reply

    They do it for moral reasons… Jacob Pendleton

    • Jacob Pendleton January 31, 2017 at 3:10 pm - Reply

      Also he’s wrong since the vast majority of crops grown go to feed the billions of animals we slaughter

    • Jacob Pendleton January 31, 2017 at 3:10 pm - Reply

      Also he’s wrong since the vast majority of crops grown go to feed the billions of animals we slaughter

  371. David Laliberte January 31, 2017 at 6:49 am - Reply

    eating meat is fine IF there were a few billion less humans to eat them AND if we did not use the meat industry in such a inhumane way.

  372. Jessica Rana January 31, 2017 at 6:53 am - Reply

    in my opinion, everyone over eats and wastes too much food.

  373. Liam Solo January 31, 2017 at 7:03 am - Reply

    The majority of earth’s crops (grain and legumes) are grown to feed cows. It takes a fraction of the amount of land mass (and damage to wildlife) to grow veggies to feed a person than it does to grow grain to feed a cow.
    This entire article is bogus and misleading and serves only the meat and dairy industries.

  374. Benjamin Chepre January 31, 2017 at 7:03 am - Reply

    Its a fact, that a lot of animal, that almost went extinct, were just bred again, to eat them :D. For a vegan, its a bit sad but for someone you likes to eat meat its nice xD.

  375. Rigdzin Palden Dorje Markus January 31, 2017 at 10:05 am - Reply

    https://youtu.be/mvGQpci9GIU Full movie with Spanish subtitles, if you watch it until the end, you’ll see where he is wrong. And of course, you can’t live without killing, this is samsara, and still, you can make a big change

  376. Dillon Hall January 31, 2017 at 7:40 am - Reply

    I heard my lettuce screaming

  377. Jessica Rose January 31, 2017 at 7:42 am - Reply

    Hahahahaha!!!!!!

  378. Nicoleta Nicoara January 31, 2017 at 7:47 am - Reply

    STOP SPREADING SUCH NONSENSE!

  379. Vash Wolf January 31, 2017 at 7:49 am - Reply

    I like my steak

  380. Jennifer Norman January 31, 2017 at 7:51 am - Reply

    My thoughts exactly

  381. Tranquil Haze January 31, 2017 at 7:55 am - Reply

    There are also holistic ways to repel animals by utilizing certain other animals or plants called companion planting. This sounds like a meat eater trying to illegitimately defend their belief by only comparing meat eating with conventional mono-cropping methods. It also excludes all of the environmental impacts of raising meat as well as all of the health benefits of a whole foods plant-based diet. I was born and raised in the midwest and ate meat for 25 years before I noticed too many cracks in what we are taught to ignore and began to educated myself to change my diet.

    Following are a few of those impacts for anyone interested in learning:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ut3URdEzlKQ

  382. Jaime Antonio Araya-Rodariguez January 31, 2017 at 7:56 am - Reply

    What an absolute joke of an argument. This doesn’t even need debating, almost every comment on this highlights his simplistic point of view.

  383. Amanito Muscario January 31, 2017 at 7:58 am - Reply

    This is so stupid that I have no words. This man don’t know that at least 60% of vegetables are cultivated for aninals to eat…

  384. Chase Jenks January 31, 2017 at 8:18 am - Reply

    Vegetarian “ism”. Vegan “ism”. their ideologies. Its means their beliefs aren’t necessarily rooted in facts, like many religions. Instead their rooted in doctrines that they are taught which may or may not be truth, but their views towards meat may be based off feelings , or some morality that has been taught to them by other followers or doctrines. PETA? Green Peace? these groups support Eco Terrorism , and misinformation to get their points across. Kind of how some people fly jets through buildings, or shoot up nightclubs for their faith. Supporting the firebombing of pounds, animal shelters, veterinarian’s offices and other things. Giving children boxes of bloodied chicken parts. Showing pictures of one incident and saying it represents and entire industry to promote your message…Not all farmers are horrible animal abusers. their are quite a few treat their animals right…Yes they eventually kill them for food but, they reduce their suffering. Not all sheep look bloodied and beaten after being sheared. Not all GMO’s are dangerous….Infact, humans have been genetically altering plants for decades. Deforestation and pollution is a problem but, it is caused by farms both raisin livestock, and growing produce. Both of which seem to have greener and more effective methods that only a few farmers are pioneering. lastly, there is no objectifiable morality that proves eating meat is evil. Probably the best method would be to balance out both meat and plants…also consider growing a taste for insects. Many countries already eat them….maybe its time first world nations join them…its just protein… and theres like billions of crickets out there.

  385. Cheryl Lambert January 31, 2017 at 11:20 am - Reply

    Bullshit! I eat organic produce..and not commercially grown vegetables and grains. I do not contribute to killing wild insects birds by eating organic. If we are trying our best to stay healthy and cause less suffering by not killing and exploitation of animals. Please please explain if we are organic vegan what are we supposed to eat then? I think this article is bollocks as it suggests vegans and vegetarians are at fault for destroying the rainforest I strongly disagree with this. The only reason such crops are grown are probably GMO crops by Monsanto. They don’t care what impact and implications they have on ecosystems, nature and humans and animals.

  386. Christi Schenk January 31, 2017 at 8:24 am - Reply

    This is a disappointment coming from this page, The Mind Unleashed. Veganism is about lessening our carbon footprint here on earth, lessening the harm we do to other sentient beings including mother nature. Lesser demand for animal products always helps…it may not deter killing and abuse altogether but it does HELP in sustaining which companies should thrive and continue. I seriously doubt the veracity of this article. Rejoice that some people could go vegan or vegetarian or even flexitarian….widening our circle of compassion to include animals and environment would prove to be so beneficial for this planet (healthy food also benefits the person). Veganism is essential also to spiritually enhance ourselves, for our ascension. Why try to discourage people from veganism when this is so good for the infinite ALL? <3

  387. Tomáš Ōkami Susko January 31, 2017 at 8:26 am - Reply

    this is the stupidest argument I ve ever read. This Italian- Argentian funny guy is argumeting with this statement: “The first impact of such foods production is the loss of forests. We are forcing nature to make room for crops. Many rainforests around the globe disappeared due to wheat and corn fields.” 🙂 Most of this corps are using also for feed that animals that you want to eat or have a milk bro. Rain forest – soya beans for animals feeding. So this is not a argument against vegetarianism and veganism but against industrial – consum capitalsit economy. very very very weak – non argument. sorry. and this argument is nothing when you have your own self production like small gardens and so on, like fully raw Kristina and so on.

  388. Jean Benoit January 31, 2017 at 8:34 am - Reply

    I love bacon. Bacon is great. I had bacon twice today. Bacon with breakfast and bacon in my veal burger. I eat plants also, but when possible i like my plants with some bacon also.

  389. Alli Browning January 31, 2017 at 8:44 am - Reply

    Not sure where the science is in this. There’s lots of quotes but little evidence. Having just read an evidence-based article countering this argument I’m dubious.

  390. Lea Leia Eberarsch January 31, 2017 at 8:52 am - Reply

    I think in most points he’s right. But if there were less production of meat, the huge slaughterhouses can be shut down and the livestock would be reduced, there were more ground for vegetabels and less animal feed to produce. So on one Hand he’s right, but He forget many points that have a big influence.

  391. Keith Taylor January 31, 2017 at 8:52 am - Reply

    This is just another “alternative fact” meat eaters like to come up with to help them sleep at night.

  392. Michael Barnett January 31, 2017 at 8:57 am - Reply

    We need less humans period

  393. Craciunescu Stefan January 31, 2017 at 9:00 am - Reply

    Years of research to make a stupid statement like this.even a 10yr old knows how much an animal eats or a human…and so on

  394. Will McGregor January 31, 2017 at 9:03 am - Reply

    Dylan share to JSDMS

    • Dylan Patel January 31, 2017 at 4:18 pm - Reply

      U do it.

    • Will McGregor January 31, 2017 at 4:27 pm - Reply

      Nah I’m not evil don’t have the heart those poor vegans

    • Dylan Patel January 31, 2017 at 4:33 pm - Reply

      They should go to this one city in India where there’s a temple, they have more cows than people because noone will do population control

    • Will McGregor January 31, 2017 at 4:35 pm - Reply

      Sounds delicious. And peaceful

  395. Kevin Watkinson January 31, 2017 at 9:19 am - Reply
  396. Владан Профировић January 31, 2017 at 9:20 am - Reply

    Main problem is that production and grow domestic animals is always in grow but there is not needed bcs number of vegetarians is also in grow and companies who producing meat don”t care for that and continue to grow more animals for killing, directly they need more farms to make food for that animals and now we both destroy forests to make more farms, but if we continue and don’t use there products then profit will be lower, like so much more we make vege much they will collapse like revolution, maybe just maybe someday we all be vege and replace farms for food animals to kill in farms with live animals and crops for all people then i am sure will be less starving in whole planet

  397. Tim Ridden January 31, 2017 at 9:29 am - Reply

    Thks article creates a perspective of thought for me that I had never thought of before. As vegetarians and vegans we like to think of ourselves as not contributing to the killing of animals, and although I chose not to eat dairy due to the killing that is involved there I had never considered the animals that are killed to protect a crop of grains, or even the animals that are killed to make room for a crop of vegetables. Here’s my humble opinion. I know that it takes much less room to grow vegetables and grains than to produce livestock, so I guess I have to be ok with that. The truth is that its impossible to live in this world without killing something, whether its an animal that walks in front of your car, even a fly or mosquito that’s you squash. For me the key is that I’m doing something at least, to minimise the suffering for other living things. It’s not a perfect system, not everything is saved, but I can say that by not eating meat of dairy I am at least doing something.

  398. Viridiana Alvarez January 31, 2017 at 9:30 am - Reply

    Wrong! The mistreatment of animals we consume thats what vegetarians are against. Mass production of meat, a cow giving life to meat, a chicken’s only purpose is eggs and discarded like trash afterwards.

  399. Eddy Nassif January 31, 2017 at 9:43 am - Reply

    Dude this is the most stupid thing i’ve ever read
    Not a 0.1% convinced

  400. Melanie Dominguez January 31, 2017 at 9:49 am - Reply

    Animals in nature do die from human impact as do plants but at least they don’t have to go through the horror of factory farming for meat production. Human beings presence on earth results in environmental impact, mostly negative, but this argument is circular and is just another meat eater trying to demonstrate that vegans and vegetarians fail in some way in their goal of helping animals. Just like when someone cruelly laughs at you for accidentally eating something that has an animal product in it. We can only try to do as much as we can to keep as many animals from suffering as possible and try to teach as many others to be compassionate towards animals. We just do our best and at least it’s something rather than pointing our that our existence is harmful.

  401. Aislinn Pilia January 31, 2017 at 9:50 am - Reply

    Mono culture of any kind is bad for the environment. Probably the worst being Beef…. this is deeply flawed argument and I’m not even vegetarian

  402. Vince Mulvena January 31, 2017 at 9:50 am - Reply

    Why kill animals, just go to the supermarket a buy it , like most others do.

  403. Neil Lawrence Joy January 31, 2017 at 9:55 am - Reply

    What a load of hoof! This is laughable & simply an obsurd argument

  404. Clara Younes January 31, 2017 at 9:56 am - Reply

    I know :p just sharing some info :p

  405. Parth Mehta January 31, 2017 at 10:07 am - Reply

    It’s Not necessary that the Scientists are only smart people on the earth. They could be idiots too. History of bizarre animal experiments is a proof. In my opinion this is dumb post

  406. Eddy Nassif January 31, 2017 at 10:09 am - Reply

    Hahahah thanks for sharing :p

  407. April Victoria King January 31, 2017 at 10:10 am - Reply

    If Bertonatti was American, Trump would write an Executive Order for him to be the editor of Vegetarian Times. Yeah, saying that Trump would appoint you to any position is the new greatest insult.

  408. Nicholas Bruce January 31, 2017 at 10:33 am - Reply

    Desperate

  409. Michelle Musgrave January 31, 2017 at 10:33 am - Reply

    Ooooo I don’t think so

  410. Anki Øde January 31, 2017 at 10:38 am - Reply

    Propaganda.

  411. Aleksandra J. Kulczycka January 31, 2017 at 10:41 am - Reply

    The dumbest argument EVER! Last time I checked I ate far less grain than a cow

  412. Sahil Bakshi January 31, 2017 at 10:41 am - Reply

    He is a moron.

  413. Arti Rajvanshi January 31, 2017 at 10:44 am - Reply

    Thats right. Dont kill the wild animals, instead breed and factory farm them under inhumane conditions, inject them with drugs, force feed them and then kill them for consumption! Thats better? Ridiculous. I dont even know why such stupid viewpoint is published on your page!

  414. Lindsay Linz Bray January 31, 2017 at 1:45 pm - Reply

    Most obvious case of pseudoscience I’ve read. Author claims to be a naturalist, but the inaccuracies and assumptions in the article are frankly laughable. Where are the ratios of crops grown for livestock consumption, versus those grown for human consumption? Where are the studies that suggest this? Where’s the research?

    The whole article reads like the ramblings of a guilty conscience, trying to deflect that guilt by accusing vegetarians and vegans of a non-existent bigger crime. It sounds like the kinds of things my guilt-ridden mind would come out with when I was trying to defend eating meat while my conscience struggled with the guilt. Been veggie for nearly 8 months and those excuses (because that is what these are) were silenced immediately.

    Also, there are more reasons than ethics alone for being vegetarian or vegan. Health benefits being one such example. No mention of those in this article.

    We’re all free to choose whether or not to eat meat. If the author’s taste for meat outweighs his guilty conscience, I’m happy for him, but he has no right to try to guilt-trip others by accusing them of a larger (non-existent) “crime” without a sliver of evidence.

  415. Greg Fitzgerald January 31, 2017 at 10:46 am - Reply

    Suck eggs vegans…

  416. Shane Holthe January 31, 2017 at 10:48 am - Reply

    this is scketch….first ..eating meat causes diseases…period…research heart surgon info…the facts are facts.

  417. Kathryn Clarke January 31, 2017 at 11:02 am - Reply

    Sarah Sarah Hickey, fair point this fellow has, lucky, I can keep eating meat

  418. Emil Emilio Emiliano January 31, 2017 at 11:07 am - Reply

    It doesn’t really matter what we do since we are 2 many, wherever we go in nature we will disturb balance, because we are so unnaturally many. If we gonna keep be as many as we are, we need to find a way where we do not disturb the nature at all.

  419. Peter Mulligan January 31, 2017 at 11:09 am - Reply

    Interesting point of view but id say he was paid for it. If the amount of land used for rearing animals was used to grow crops instead the world would be abundant with food.

  420. Lisa Russo January 31, 2017 at 11:10 am - Reply

    This sounds like Trump logic

  421. David Muñoz Fernandez January 31, 2017 at 11:23 am - Reply

    oh no! i am falling in the dangerous way of my own nature!

  422. Kayla Johnson January 31, 2017 at 11:26 am - Reply

    lmfaooo noooo claudio bertonatti is a dumb ass

  423. Janthina Nastasija January 31, 2017 at 11:27 am - Reply

    I don’t think this is why people are vegetarians. Its generally the sentinent beings like oh i dunno, living animals, that vegetarians want to save, not the plants. Oh and of course the fact that we currently live in a world where farmers in the U.K and U.S.A are giving fresh grain and water to animals that wouldn’t have ever been alive were they not forcefully produced through hormones/breeding so that i can have a greggs sausage roll whenever i like while there are children starving in the world essentially eating less than my mcdonalds burger is. Not to mention the damage it has on the enviroment.

    Saving things that can be replanted within months with little cost to the enviroment? Not our biggest concern i don’t think.

  424. Tiana Bryce January 31, 2017 at 11:29 am - Reply

    The tag didn’t work properly but I’m gonna show you a documentary and some research journals tomorrow that’ll blow your little mind

  425. Yazan Sitabouha January 31, 2017 at 11:33 am - Reply

    This is bullshit, he is trying to prove his point through the actions of minorities, many vegetarians simply grow their crops in their small gardens that does not affect or help in killing any animal, on the contrary it will attract bees and birds. He thinks that all people aren’t educated or/and conscious enough about the ecosystem and how the cycle goes.

  426. Taijara A Lucas January 31, 2017 at 11:35 am - Reply

    He clearly missed the whole point! Try again “Mr Argentinian Naturalist”

  427. Vicky Angeli January 31, 2017 at 11:35 am - Reply

    a very uneducated article…!! Paid again by the meat industry, eh??

  428. David M Hayden January 31, 2017 at 2:41 pm - Reply

    This guy is an idiot. He’s saying that most of Amazon deforestation is for wheat and corn, which is true. However, that wheat and corn go to feed AGRICULTURE. Vegan and vegetarian impacts on the environment are exponentially less than that of a meat eater. Plus, I personally don’t want to consume the torture, misery, carnage, and absolute horror that factory farmed animals endure. No thanks.

  429. Danny Courtney January 31, 2017 at 11:43 am - Reply

    Harriet thought you’d like to read this x

  430. Famke Nonya January 31, 2017 at 11:43 am - Reply

    I don’t eat wheat and rarely eat corn products. Also like mentioned before most animals are vegetarians. So it is hard to agree with this article. She has the right to share her view about this but next time she might want to do more research on things.

  431. Francisco Petri January 31, 2017 at 11:53 am - Reply

    Such a dumb argument. And unfortunately this page seem To support it. The majority of the crops are for cattle feeding. Too obvious.

  432. Kyle M Vires January 31, 2017 at 11:54 am - Reply

    It’s like saying we wouldn’t need oil if we all road our bikes to work… Retarded

  433. Jess Perez-Tirse January 31, 2017 at 11:54 am - Reply

    And before u go crazy, no I do not agree with him. I think vegetarians just don’t want to support the abuse of animals in slaughterhouses. I just think it’s funny how people find something wrong with everything lol.

  434. Mohammed Almallah January 31, 2017 at 11:55 am - Reply

    Sofía , Damn it , Both Ways Killing Animals

  435. Stace Danger Eastwood January 31, 2017 at 11:55 am - Reply

    This is so stupid. What about the farm animals – they need plants grown for them to eat. And of course we all know farming animals for meat uses far more land and resources than farming vegetables. His arguments don’t even make sense.

  436. Tanya Ward January 31, 2017 at 12:01 pm - Reply

    So let’s not eat anything

  437. Mike Davies January 31, 2017 at 12:03 pm - Reply

    So many triggered vegans lel

  438. Ness Caira January 31, 2017 at 12:10 pm - Reply

    not a very convincing argument..

  439. Patrick Le Roux January 31, 2017 at 12:32 pm - Reply

    yea!! right just trying make himself feel justified each to his own, my family some are vegetarians some are meat eaters it is just a personal viewpoint if you are ok with eating meat that is your choice personally I prefer not to

  440. Gary Loewenthal January 31, 2017 at 12:37 pm - Reply

    Not only are fewer animals killed when we go vegan (http://www.animalvisuals.org/projects/data/1mc), but they’re also not systematically bred to suffer, ripped from their families, and mass slaughtered mostly as babies. The overwhelming majority of vegans divest from this cruel system not because they don’t like the taste of meat (look at the popularity of Gardein and Beyond Meat), but because they realize that it’s fundamentally wrong to inflict easily avoidable harm on innocents, and because the science shows that it’s nearly impossible to meet lower greenhouse emissions targets without a shift away from animal agriculture.

    In addition, animal agriculture is not sustainable from an ecological or hunger perspective. The UN, the Worldwatch Institute, the Center for Biological Diversity, even National Geographic urge us to sharply reduce meat consumption in order to feed an ever-growing human population and preserve what’s left of the world’s natural resources.

  441. Mildred Reiniers January 31, 2017 at 12:41 pm - Reply

    Lots of vegetarians don’t eat meat out of protest how animals are reared and kept thought – not necessarily about the fact that they are killed.

  442. Jan Andres Villar January 31, 2017 at 12:43 pm - Reply

    What an idiot Who did this? If he wants many Kind of cancer or he likes to be sick is his problem not mine

  443. Jake Jackrabbit Bray January 31, 2017 at 3:48 pm - Reply

    The issue with sharing such an article is that you should also point out the invalid points with Claudio Bertonatti’s ‘research‘. It sounds like Claudio was sitting there and concluded such things with little consideration about how it all works. By sharing a foolish thought, can reflect on the quality of the articles you write.

    It can appear you’re regurgitating other people’s articles without analysis or considering what impacts such bias and misinformation articles can have.

  444. David Sárközi January 31, 2017 at 12:49 pm - Reply

    Carla Gina bammmmm stop killing my food

  445. Julia Kelly January 31, 2017 at 1:01 pm - Reply

    This article is nonsense. He is actually describing problems of factory farming. My question is, who funded this travesty?

  446. Angela Brown January 31, 2017 at 1:06 pm - Reply

    Takes 85% of our farmland to support livestock.

  447. Robin Kay D January 31, 2017 at 1:11 pm - Reply

    Dont attack the Vegans. They are not very bright, it’s not their fault. Their bodies are missing key nutrients for brain health only found in animal protein. Beans and supplements do not replace them.

  448. Isa Maria Araujo January 31, 2017 at 1:11 pm - Reply

    Makes no sense at all.

  449. SuVasini Shakya January 31, 2017 at 1:16 pm - Reply

    There u go Shristi Shakya

  450. Vi Va January 31, 2017 at 1:19 pm - Reply

    Ok I get the argument but what is there left to eat? Either way people have to end up destroying the planet to some extent to survive…

  451. Ian McGinn January 31, 2017 at 1:21 pm - Reply

    So why not just east meat!

  452. Alice Taylor January 31, 2017 at 1:22 pm - Reply

    Ben, this is the most ridiculous thing I have ever read… the majority of grains etc that are farmed in large quantities are to feed fecking livestock – If this is your way of defending what you do and the guilt inside of you then thumbs up pal – I am going to assume this is a joke on your behalf because I am pretty sure you are not dumb enough to think this is correct!

  453. Vi Va January 31, 2017 at 1:29 pm - Reply

    No thanks. I’m decreasing as much destruction as I can.

  454. Jagadisvari Hales January 31, 2017 at 1:42 pm - Reply

    Killing an animal is murder! There is a soul in that animal body, just like a human!❤

  455. Claudio Postinghel January 31, 2017 at 1:43 pm - Reply

    You think you don’t kill dogs becouse you don’t eat dog meat? And so? Is this a reason for eat them? Obviously, if you kill dogs is not ethical kill dogs.

    Some people, like asians, think that eating dogs, horses and cows is ethical.
    Some people, like americans, think that eating dogs is not ethical, but eating horses and cows is ethical.
    Some people, like british people, think that eating dogs and horses is not ethical, but eating cows is ethical.
    Some people, like vegan, think think that eating dogs, horses and cows is not ethical.

  456. Melanie Nordberg January 31, 2017 at 1:44 pm - Reply

    This isn’t an argument against veganism. It is an argument against mono-cropping. People who are vegan for the animals also believe in diverse systems of growing food that benefits both humans and wildlife. I am a vegan and a strong supporter of permaculture. Permaculture mimics natural systems. Also left out of the argument is the fact that most mono-crops of grain only exist because we need food for livestock being raised in intensive systems. We already grow enough plant food to feed everyone, so these crops can be reverted to wildlife habitat. On top of this, all land currently being used for grazing can be reverted to wildlife habitat. While some wildlife species survive and even thrive on man-man pastures, this can create an imbalance where some species outnumber others. Most grazing land was previously forest, with thousands of hectares being cleared annually across the world for grazing land alone. Clearing for more land to grow food for livestock also continues. In arid zones such as outback Australia, the wildlife dynamics have been changed by graziers bringing permanent water sources into area that previously had seasonal water, resulting in exploding and permanent populations of kangaroos that grazed alongside the cattle and a placed burden upon the land that did not previously exist. The author of this article is not only basing his assumptions upon a particular type of vegetable food and wrongly predicting that these types of crop will become the main staple of vegans, but his standing as an environmentalist is damaged by his lack of ability to consider all of the facts in this argument.

  457. Brianna Brown January 31, 2017 at 1:56 pm - Reply

    Olivia Gould interesting perspective

  458. Onur Uska Vago January 31, 2017 at 1:57 pm - Reply

    “From the moment humans began to cultivate cereals and work in the fields, it has already made an impact on nature and especially the wildlife. There are no animal species that are not connected to the system, the survival of some depends on death, whether directly or indirectly. I understand that this knowledge can be painful. I’d like to live in an ideal world,”
    Well as a vegetarian, I agree with these words. But I don’t agree at all with this : ‘all or nothing’ attitude. The conclusion drawn from ‘the survival of some depends on death, whether directly or indirectly. ‘ may be ‘So be it then. I can just go kill some animals and exploit the habitat whenever I like, even just for fun and so forth.’
    But doesn’t it hold true for human vs human relation ? My being rich depends on some else’s being poor. This holds true for most economical relation tdoay. Maybe this mindset has to change. or maybe not I don’t know. But personally I prefer living in the opposite direction ‘as much as I can’. So no matter how wrong/ illogical / stupid one may sound, (if) the fact that he’s caring for some other species, makes me happy. We need more of such feelings / ideas. And we all know that we should do (or stop doing) much more than just stop eating meat. I’ve never met a vegetarian/vegan who says ‘I am vegetarian and that’s it. I am no more responsible for any environmental or animal- related issues of the world.

  459. Reha Sharma January 31, 2017 at 2:01 pm - Reply

    Whatever

  460. Ibrahem Yones January 31, 2017 at 2:09 pm - Reply

    I agree that by being vegetarian you kill animals by indirect way !. but the livestock animals industry has much greater negative effect also in the enviroment and in the other wild animals ,thats because cows , chicken ,turkey ,etc these animals need big fields to live in so owner destroy the lands and forests in order to obtain these lands, in adittion to that these animals eat a huge amount of food, and in order to get that food owners cut the rain forests and destroy the home of alot of species .
    So by eating meat you are doing more damage and killing more animals than from you being a vegetarian.!

  461. Severin Johnson January 31, 2017 at 2:22 pm - Reply

    From whatever angle you see it… the real problem is still human overpopulation!

  462. Aarushi Solanki January 31, 2017 at 2:38 pm - Reply

    Read down the comments u’ll get ur answer

  463. Anita van Hussen January 31, 2017 at 2:41 pm - Reply

    I dont like meat, the taste cannibalism to me

  464. Gabriela Korenska January 31, 2017 at 2:44 pm - Reply

    Dumbest thing i have read :)))

  465. Jerry Williams January 31, 2017 at 2:52 pm - Reply

    …So, he took a walk through a wheat field and didn’t see any birds? this is his scientific research? Sorry, observation? For one wheat has become so bastardized there is little to no nutritional value to it at all. There would be no birds because there are none that would eat that shit willingly, and if they ate the wheat or insects they’d die from Glyphosate poisoning. Again no birds to see. We want scientific research!… When do we want it?… After peer review!

  466. Amy Barbour January 31, 2017 at 2:54 pm - Reply

    Sure we just survive of air then……. lol

  467. Johnny Muir Addleman January 31, 2017 at 2:57 pm - Reply

    Weird perspective and no proposal for change… forests are destroyed for cattle land too and grazing animals consume more calories in feed than produced. It’s important to understand connections and food production but it’s about minimizing not eliminating impact. Maybe better farms and sustainable foods are the solution instead of baiting people with blanket statements 🙂

  468. Aaron Armstrong January 31, 2017 at 3:11 pm - Reply

    Hey guess what veggie munchers, just cause you don’t eat meat, animals still die to get you your food! Combines used to clear wheat for example kill ground eating birds, baby deer, mice, snakes ect, the more you know

  469. Vageesh Vishnoi January 31, 2017 at 3:15 pm - Reply

    Siddhi Our only weapons against Non vegetarians is useless now. 🙁

  470. Murtuza Abbas January 31, 2017 at 3:28 pm - Reply

    Jignesh Gohil must read for you

  471. Peter Wegmann January 31, 2017 at 3:29 pm - Reply

    Ok so yes unknowingly still some animal dies because of us humans not vegans but humans because grain and vegetables are not exclusively grown for us. It’s good to know that this happens! Vegans and vegetarian are growing in numbers so props to us by getting started! Instead of criticizing and making excuses why you can’t skip meat maybe this guy could use this info to improve things out there for the animal . Because nobody is saying we are perfect.

  472. Kathy Louttchenko Nicolaidou January 31, 2017 at 3:33 pm - Reply

    Alexandra OMG I WAS RIGHT! this is exactly the point i made xD just put in a must nicer way

  473. Michelle Durrington January 31, 2017 at 3:47 pm - Reply

    Good reading I like to keep an open mind and do my research I do believe there are animals killed but its not a big enough argument as the meat you eat consumes that much grain etc… Meat eaters double this

  474. Jordan Carvalho January 31, 2017 at 3:50 pm - Reply

    Whoever wrote this is mentally handicapped! Basically they just through together some bullshit. It takes much more deforestation to feed livestock than human beings!

  475. Jordan Carvalho January 31, 2017 at 3:53 pm - Reply

    I know most argentinians eat beef and pork with every meal so it’s very hard to have this conversation.

  476. Robert Conroy January 31, 2017 at 4:12 pm - Reply

    No ancient culture was ever vegan, or vegetarian. This is a brand new P.E.T.A. thing. No vegan knows anything about nutrition. Vegan = EPA/DHA omega-3, vitamin D, and B12 deficiencies. Three of the worst deficiencies that hurt you and give you serious mental health problems.

  477. Sherif Errefae January 31, 2017 at 4:22 pm - Reply

    What do livestock animals grow on? GRAINS!! They feed them double the amount of grains needed to feed the entire humans! which results in a wider damaged forests, more wild animals killed, horrible amount of water 4 times as much water as the humans need.

  478. James Sebolt January 31, 2017 at 4:33 pm - Reply

    This is completely false. Livestock animals eat exponentially more vegetation per capita than a vegan/vegetarian. Not only do you have to put land aside for the domesticated animals, you have to put land aside to grow the food for the animals as well. If nobody ate meat, you would no longer require the land (which is quite a lot) to raise the livestock. This is just an attempt to not feel bad for meat consumption by whoever wrote this fallacy.

  479. Anil Hemnath January 31, 2017 at 4:54 pm - Reply

    So then are we to continue eating meat? What nonsense

  480. Marianne Wessels January 31, 2017 at 4:57 pm - Reply

    Ok, i am convinced. I don’t want to hurt animals, so I am gonna eat meat again. Since i already eat vegetables and fruit and it harms animals, I should add in even more harm into my diet and eat animals flesh whos throats are slit. *sarcasm ends now*

  481. Tuğba Polatcan January 31, 2017 at 4:59 pm - Reply

    This is the most stupid argument I have ever heard against not eating meat. Killings of a few birds compared to all the livestock that people consume every day? Also crop fields don’t destroy the rainforests. Greedy people who cut the trees all the time to make more and more money destroy the rainforests. This argument is so dumb that I can’t even stand it..

  482. Dylan Wylde January 31, 2017 at 5:19 pm - Reply

    I think there’s a moral case for it. But there’s a moral case for a lot of things. There’s a moral case for the fact that if you look at deaths from starvation, human deaths, among children, forget everyone else, among children alone deaths from starvation, or starvation related diseases, are about twice the level of Rwanda. Not 100 days, but every day. OK, that’s a problem.
    Now, you can say, well, let’s deal with both, and mention a thousand other problems. Let’s deal with them all. Time and energy happen to be finite. Which means you have to pick and choose. You can’t do everything. So, you have to set priorities. I could pick 20 other cases, but let’s pick this one. Suppose I have a choice between devoting energy and effort to writing books, and giving talks and so on, about trying to save the children, which is, you know, pennies a day, I mean, there’s almost nothing to it. Very little effort, to stop the double Rwanda style killing among children every day. And there’s a choice between that and essentially carrying out mass genocide of domesticated animals. Because that’s what vegetarianism means. It’s an effort to reduce animal suffering.
    Suppose we all became vegetarians. The first thing you’d have to do is eliminate almost all domesticated animals because, well, they’re raised for eating meat. That’s why we have cows, chickens, sheep, you know, and so on and so forth. So, somehow, you got to get rid of them. You can’t just let them reproduce and proliferate. First of all, they’ll starve to death if you don’t feed them, so it would be genocide anyway. And that’s one of the immediate consequences of vegetarianism. You can pretend you don’t notice, but it is. So, ok, these are things to balance.

  483. Magdalena Kachel January 31, 2017 at 5:21 pm - Reply

    What is wrong with people why we have enough to justify what we eat ?? Keeping balance fighting the smother houses and indore farms where injustice is done supporting local humain farmers. U can’t force and expect others to change to what you what them but you can educate them how to do it right away do in moderation and articulate is kind of bull and I do eat meat and meat products

  484. Louise Andréasson January 31, 2017 at 5:26 pm - Reply

    Really??

  485. Jonathon Lee Stuckey January 31, 2017 at 5:29 pm - Reply

    How infuriating. For the love of humanity I hope this is just trolling. The sad part is that so many people will read this and go about spewing the horrendous misinformation. Good to see all you well informed people speaking up here!

  486. Hank Taylor January 31, 2017 at 5:32 pm - Reply

    Nonsense article and I’m not vegetarian

  487. Ralph Graham January 31, 2017 at 8:39 pm - Reply

    Such an old argument, a beat up, as useless as it was before it started getting copied around the world by people who manage to copy and paste but not to think.

    This is just one of a number of scornful articles written the author acts like s/he is confounding veganism/animal rights saying it is a sham, built on a lie, that we (vegans) are all hypocrites. This based on the idea that we don’t kill anything – we do, and that we claim we don’t- we do not.claim that. Just another hollow beat up.

    Animal lives are lost in the harvesting of crops and we are not about to start living on air. We willingly kill bacteria, tapeworms, termites and more.

    What we stand for is causing as little harm as possible to animal life and for each of us the exact boundary is going to be different and change over time.

    One ridiculous argument we get is that vegans would need more crops so more death would result. But, massive amounts of the crops grown are fed to animals to make meat so all that crop area could be used for humans. It also takes much less area to feed people from crops than it does to raise animals for food so that alone invalidates such claims.

    The opening statement. “Among vegans and vegetarians, there are those who choose to do so simply because they prefer it – they do not like to eat meat.”
    More fiction. Vegans are people who don’t eat animals (or use their products) because they hold that they have the right to live. The ugly assembly line of mass bred animals going to their death is totally unnecessary and is ruining the earth.

  488. Howard Smith January 31, 2017 at 5:52 pm - Reply

    It takes 70 billion animals to feed the 8 billion humans each year. These 70 billion animals take much more land to grow crops to feed these animals than humans. It is the main reason for deforestation and global warming if you believe in global warming. So I believe this guy is not correct in his assumptions.

  489. Glowacki Christopher January 31, 2017 at 6:08 pm - Reply

    Dianna Derigo what do you think?

    • Dianna Derigo January 31, 2017 at 8:53 pm - Reply

      I think this is an interesting thought but it is not a result of being vegetarian that causes these deaths, but rather a result of the overconsumption and wastefulness of resources by many industrialized areas of the world as well as a result of the rapid growing population. However, the effect of the death of animals, I believe, would never be comparable to eating meat on a regular basis. This argument can be made for nearly any aspect of the world that humans touch, there has to be a line because no matter what we do we are bound to have an effect on the ecosystem. Given this, I think it would be ignorant for this argument to persuade an individual in to not eating a plant based diet, because to me the logic is flawed.

    • Glowacki Christopher January 31, 2017 at 9:36 pm - Reply

      I think I’ll just eat tissue paper that way no animals or plants are hurt.

  490. Jean Thompson January 31, 2017 at 6:14 pm - Reply

    exactly – if we ndont need them they die out, like tigers, bears….etc

  491. Peter Nolan January 31, 2017 at 6:15 pm - Reply

    Insightful viewpoint on vegan and vegetarian lifestyles.

  492. John Routh January 31, 2017 at 6:25 pm - Reply

    Have to respectfully disagree….. Rainforests are disappearing in order to make more land available to farm animals and the corn they are raised on. While his statement and research may prove that innocent wild animals are killed in protecting these areas, it’s far less than the amount of animals each meat eater is responsible for indirectly killing each year.

  493. Zahra Noori January 31, 2017 at 6:31 pm - Reply

    Khala Jan I’m not a vegetarian anymore and it was never my intention on saving the animals it was more of a diet choice .

  494. Rabia Wali January 31, 2017 at 6:32 pm - Reply

    Love u

  495. Zahra Noori January 31, 2017 at 6:32 pm - Reply

    Love you more

  496. Shaun Soto January 31, 2017 at 6:46 pm - Reply

    It’s a fair point, BUT… If you take the amount of crops needed to produce meat and dairy as opposed to eating the crops directly .. You are left with only 10% of the land needed to produce all your vegan food. So that’s 90% less animals dying as a result of growing crops. ALSO.. How many of the farmers growing these crops are vegetarian/vegan themselves? I bet not many. If they were their farming practises and methods would change. Neither of these facts have been taken into account in this guys excuse to consume meat. Now whilst I agree that hunting yourself is far more ethical even though I don’t agree with it personally. What percentage of people kill their own ‘meat’? The fact is 22 million animals die every day in horrific factory farms in the UK alone.

  497. Janis Edwards Cole January 31, 2017 at 7:08 pm - Reply

    I am a vegetarian, simply because i love vegatables instead of meat…

  498. Vivek Verma January 31, 2017 at 7:09 pm - Reply

    Hilarious and nonsense.

  499. Tony Anthony January 31, 2017 at 7:24 pm - Reply

    So does it make u good to eat}}or bad to eat . ?..

  500. Jean-Yves Watts Tamayo January 31, 2017 at 7:27 pm - Reply

    wow this statement is invalid. at every step of the food chain there is a huge loss of energy to pass on to the next food chain. ie cows eat a lot of “plant products” and we only eat a fraction of it.

  501. Colleen Carpenter January 31, 2017 at 7:45 pm - Reply

    stupid argument and I am not a veg head

  502. Molly Schmoo Chase January 31, 2017 at 8:09 pm - Reply

    Except that 30% of the land on Earth is used for Animal Agriculture. Including their feed which is corn, soy, wheat based.
    Animal agriculture is the most resource intensive industry.

  503. Si Grizzly Main January 31, 2017 at 8:12 pm - Reply

    Jesus christ… what utter nonsense

    • Si Grizzly Main January 31, 2017 at 8:24 pm - Reply

      Another clueless argument

    • Si Grizzly Main January 31, 2017 at 8:28 pm - Reply

      Why don’t you get your own opinion Callum Davis you shit stirring pig..!!

    • Skye-Maria Daines January 31, 2017 at 8:29 pm - Reply

      Cal loves his wooden spoon – but what he actually dont know si is the joke is on him lol

    • Si Grizzly Main January 31, 2017 at 8:31 pm - Reply

      He is no better than the feeble opinionated man that thinks we are ‘cavemen’ and are entitled to eat meat!

  504. Syd Maddox January 31, 2017 at 8:23 pm - Reply

    So glad to see my fellow vegans standing up for the cause, especially when false and rediculous “information” is being spread. Keep on preaching the truth ❤❤

  505. Peter James Cassidy January 31, 2017 at 8:24 pm - Reply

    Everything has conscious treat it as such

  506. Syed Usman January 31, 2017 at 8:48 pm - Reply

    It’s a simple system. Farmers clear a lot of land to farm and grow vegetables for people. In clearing land the destroy the local habitat. The local habitat includes all kinds of life like insects plants and wildlife. Just to feed the vegetarians. Every year forests and wildlife are cleared and destroyed to grow crops to feed the people of the world. Some are vegans and others eat both veggies and meat. Now which is more cruel? Destroying innocent wildlife and habitat or the slaughterhouse? Mind you I don’t like the way some idiots slaughter animals since there is a way to slaughter with as little pain as possible. Just because of the mindless selfish ideology of some vegans who don’t realize their acts can cause more harm then good. It’s a hard choice though. Since it really doesn’t matter if you are vegan or not. There is no right answer to this no matter the argument you put

  507. Ina Inanna January 31, 2017 at 8:59 pm - Reply

    This is so idiotic! There are other forms of agriculture. He is talking about industrial monoculture with chemicals which is just another stupid and wrong form of producing food. He should read about biodynamic ecologic agriculture before he speaks! Moreover everyone can produce vegetables at home…

  508. Billy Kure January 31, 2017 at 9:05 pm - Reply

    i just think i don’t eat animals, because i don’t eat meat.

  509. Amanda Smith Sanidas January 31, 2017 at 9:08 pm - Reply

    Οversimplified nonsense..

  510. Sadaf Gul January 31, 2017 at 9:29 pm - Reply

    Wow…so should we start eating animals? what is your solution? Please don’t post this stuff it doesn’t help, it just gives more excuses for people who ignore so obvious violence that is happening right now.

  511. Juan Andres Herrera Uribe January 31, 2017 at 9:50 pm - Reply

    And what does the domestic animals eat? They also eat what vegetarians and much more. Please try to think no yo justify

  512. Billie Schneider January 31, 2017 at 9:56 pm - Reply

    This is a stupid article, of course every animal and plant plays a part in the balance of nature. Of course land is cleared to make way for plantations, but thats because theres 7 Billion of us. Even if we only eat grain/veges , Human people still need to eat.
    Animals will die wether we kill them or not, but Humans need to survive aswell.

  513. Grant Thomas February 1, 2017 at 1:06 am - Reply

    Cini mate this is utter nonsense. More farmed animals are killed for meat per year than the number of humans who have ever existed on this planet. Very few of those animals eat grass. If we bred and killed less animals for food, we would use less land to grow crops to feed them before slaughter, therefore saving more wild animals in the process. It’s pretty basic logic mate. This guy just wants to eat meat and is trying to find any old excuse to justify it. What’s more, I’m pretty sure we’ve had this exact conversation in the teacher’s room countless times before!!!

  514. Nemanja Bakalic January 31, 2017 at 10:23 pm - Reply

    What a loud of crap Claudio Bertonatti, f.off …

  515. Jake Judson January 31, 2017 at 10:32 pm - Reply

    I love Steak.

  516. Harwill Diemling January 31, 2017 at 10:39 pm - Reply

    We feed 100 billion livestock animals GMO grain.

    There are only 7.5 billion of us.
    You do the math.

    Ps we are already feeding the human population plants don’t forget.
    As systems develop the animals killed for crop production will reduce.

    Bit of an odd article really. Doesn’t add up when scrutinised.

  517. Míša Dejlová January 31, 2017 at 10:43 pm - Reply

    This guy is the dumbest person on the planet

  518. Vegan Unleashed January 31, 2017 at 10:45 pm - Reply

    Absolutely ridiculous. And here’s the best rebuttle. Check and mate

    http://www.animalvisuals.org/projects/data/1mc/

  519. Morten Stenberg January 31, 2017 at 10:50 pm - Reply

    Some people feel guilty about life, and some people don’t. If I stop killing animals for food, and every other people does the same thing, these animals will still be killed by carnivorous animals (usually in a much more harmful way). That’s nature, the vegan and the anti-hunter says. I say: you “animal-loving” vegans are just as guilty as any other human.

  520. David Donachie January 31, 2017 at 10:57 pm - Reply

    His argument is all wrong because, here in France, most of the maize grown is to go towards animal feed……

  521. Karolina Widanka January 31, 2017 at 10:58 pm - Reply

    Well whoever wrote it didn’t put a lot of thought in lol. Yes forests are cut down for crops, inevitable. But that’s different to planting crops and then clearing more land to feed the animals.. Or the majority of land cleared for agriculture in general.
    Still think it’s troll lol

  522. Maduka Wilburn January 31, 2017 at 11:12 pm - Reply

    Okay so what are we supposed to do then? Just eat air and die? It seems that just being human period will have an impact on the natural world and environmentalist try to offset the human footprint in various ways. So this is neat information but pointless for the most part if there is no solution offered to vegans and vegetarians in light of it.

  523. Michael Henderson January 31, 2017 at 11:14 pm - Reply

    This is why I don’t eat meat. Later I found that my blood pressure lowered and I feel much better too.
    https://youtu.be/32IDVdgmzKA

  524. Bianca Elise January 31, 2017 at 11:28 pm - Reply

    No no no read the comments

  525. Elenka Slovenka January 31, 2017 at 11:43 pm - Reply

    Interesting read …

  526. Heath R. Tessmann January 31, 2017 at 11:58 pm - Reply

    what does this guy eat then

  527. Dana Heston February 1, 2017 at 12:04 am - Reply

    Perhaps more humane ways??

  528. Touché Holden February 1, 2017 at 12:19 am - Reply

    If you eat milk products, you’re supporting the killing of many bobby calves also.

  529. Lori Roman February 1, 2017 at 12:24 am - Reply

    It’s all about lessening your foot print. It’s about doing what you can. Its not about being perfect, its about being conscious of what your actions do to another living being. It does make a difference. If you throw a rock into a calm pond, does it not make a ripple? I saw the other day where they are making meat that doesn’t harm any animals, has no diseases and tastes like the real thing in a lab. Perfect in every way. Harms no one… If I have to eat meat, I’m perfectly fine having it made in a test tube if I can spare one animal the torture, abuse, and evil of factory farming. All beings deserve to be free.

  530. Danieka Marshall February 1, 2017 at 12:35 am - Reply

    Lol. He used one farm as an example too

  531. Andrea Gravel February 1, 2017 at 12:46 am - Reply

    Ridiculus

  532. Vivian Brien February 1, 2017 at 1:35 am - Reply

    Seems to me a lot of those crops are grown to feed animals.

  533. Nicholas Veron February 1, 2017 at 2:00 am - Reply

    A tiny bit of research would show this article to be false… Why post it?

  534. Eileen Lois Hittle February 1, 2017 at 5:13 am - Reply

    And….you said, in the beginning, you didn’t know what you were talking about…I was friendly trying to have a good conversation…and then you insult me and try to play this whole “you’re actually really stupid and ignorant listen to me even though I have no sources and said I don’t know enough about this!!11!!” Lol k. Don’t worry though. I’m never, ever wasting my time on you again.

  535. Daryan Tabor February 1, 2017 at 2:42 am - Reply

    Don’t get me wrong I love meat as much as the next guy but clearing land for farming is a ONE time event, raising livestock usually requires similar land to be cleared and then more and more and more livestock raised and slaughtered.

  536. Ann Marie Sylvaney February 1, 2017 at 2:44 am - Reply

    That is a weak argument. Not valid.

  537. Thomas Lewis February 1, 2017 at 3:32 am - Reply

    I want a steak right now

  538. Gail Stevenson February 1, 2017 at 6:35 am - Reply

    This is the most stupid thing I’ve ever read. The majority of the cultivated crops grown on this planet are to feed farm animals that we then eat! I am not a Vegan or even a vegetarian but I fully support a significant reduction in the amount of animal products we consume. There is well documented, strong evidence of not only the health benefits of eating less meat but the enormous environmental benefits.

  539. Eileen Lois Hittle February 1, 2017 at 3:54 am - Reply

    Do you agree with this article? I have sooooo many rebuttals!

  540. Scott Matznick February 1, 2017 at 4:00 am - Reply

    I’m not educated enough in that field to make a comment.

  541. Eileen Lois Hittle February 1, 2017 at 4:01 am - Reply

    I have done tons of research if you want to learn more about it! Of course I am biased because I ultimately decided to go vegan but I read and watched quite a bit of material before making that decision.

  542. Scott Matznick February 1, 2017 at 4:10 am - Reply

    I suppose my opinion on this is as follows…
    This is necessary
    This is necessary
    Life feeds on life
    Feeds on life
    Feeds on….

    As far as that specific article is saying, I’m not sure how you can deny that the techniques used in corporate farming damage all aspects of the ecosystem, animals included.

  543. Eileen Lois Hittle February 1, 2017 at 4:14 am - Reply

    Easy. Humans need to eat way less plants than animals do. Farming of livestock animals requires far more space and materials when you think of how much they eat and how much waste they excrete. Eating a plant based diet is much better for the environment. I highly suggest watching Cowspiracy for more information. It’s on Netflix.

  544. Eileen Lois Hittle February 1, 2017 at 4:16 am - Reply

    The guy who made that documentary really knows his stuff. He cites all of his sources and explains it far better than I could via fb. But long story short, animal farming uses way more resources than plant farming, and this is is easy to see when you think of how much plant material those animals need to eat vs how much humans could eat if they eat a plant based diet; also we breed those animals at an unnatural rate to keep up with how much meat the world consumes.

  545. Scott Matznick February 1, 2017 at 4:27 am - Reply

    I don’t really think you actually answered my question. All you did was attempt to justify it, in a poorly biased fashion. Less is not better. Though we do eat less, we also waste more. You didn’t even touch on the main focus of the article, which is that there are symptoms of the agricultural methods which harm animal life. It had nothing to do with who eats less of what, but how the food is produced. Your vegan diet requires a lot more harmful chemicals being put into the soil than you might think. I think it’s incredibly short sighted to compare your diet to that of an animal. The way foods are farmed for humans- not so much other animals, as they’re not quite as picky as we are- is aggressive and detrimental to the environment as a whole. Delude yourself all you want, but either way, it’s become a very harmful industry on all fronts.

  546. Eileen Lois Hittle February 1, 2017 at 4:34 am - Reply

    I did answer your question though and I read the article. The article fails to acknowledge that by not eating meat for a day you save more water than not showering for months. You also ignored my simple math (as did the article) that shows eating a plant based diet by definition uses less material from the earth. Studies show that eating a plant based diet does less harm than not. I never said that eating a plant based diet can’t harm animals, but it sure harms them less than eating them and clearing away acres of land to feed livestock. Not to mention how many chemicals go into processing meats if that’s what you’re afraid of…seriously watch Cowspiracy. I’m certainly not deluding myself, I’ve read and watched far more than one Facebook article 😉

    Personally, the health benefits I’ve experienced since going vegan are amazing. I’m slimmer, have lower blood pressure, have more energy, and have clearer skin. And, my blood work is perfect.

  547. Zawadi Moraa February 1, 2017 at 4:34 am - Reply

    Amen.and am thankful to God for his unending Grace for me and my family.

  548. Eileen Lois Hittle February 1, 2017 at 4:38 am - Reply

    I know you’re not gonna agree with me because of this fb convo. Just watch that documentary and then tell me what you think. The evidence is pretty damning, imo.

  549. Eileen Lois Hittle February 1, 2017 at 4:38 am - Reply

    Also watch Earthlings if you’re concerned about animal welfare. On youtube

  550. Scott Matznick February 1, 2017 at 4:48 am - Reply

    I don’t agree with you not because of this conversation, but because you refuse to even acknowledge any other points of view. For being a very smart person, for some reason, you choose the least intelligent form of discussion.

  551. Eileen Lois Hittle February 1, 2017 at 4:50 am - Reply

    On stuff I’ve already spent ample time researching and literally seen the benefits of myself, no I’m not interested in other points of view unless they come from a credible source, and I don’t consider a Facebook page called “the mind unleashed” to be credible. If you decide to research this topic and find actual evidence, I would be happy to listen to it. I’ve actually given you some sources, btw.

  552. Jacqueline Lapensee February 1, 2017 at 4:56 am - Reply

    I’m not sure what the point is in this article – to prove to vegans that we are actually equally guilty in the unnecessary death of animals? Is this to relieve the guilt of those that participate in the slaughter of farm animals? Any sort of land clearing for agriculture will amount in harm to certain animals. The point is to drastically reduce the amount of clearing to breed animals and their required feed.

  553. Scott Matznick February 1, 2017 at 5:04 am - Reply

    It’s called real world experience. I’ve worked for years in the landscape/ farm industry, and I’ve seen the effect of the chemicals that are used. I’ve researched the products we sprayed in order to pass a training course. Eileen give it up. We know you’re vegan, and I’m really glad that works for you. But please don’t pretend that your way is somehow better. All I did was tag my wife in a post about a subject we’ve been discussing. I have a lot more knowledge than what little I learned in that article. I think you are letting your own existence get to your head a bit. By trying to be the smartest person in the room, you actually tend to prove the opposite… notice how you considered your “ample” research more valid than mine, without even taking into account the research I’ve done? That’s true ignorance. You’ve done nothing but argue for the sake of argument, citing what… YouTube? Netflix? I’m astounded by how smart you think you are, and by how little real world knowledge you have to actually back your claims up.

  554. Eileen Lois Hittle February 1, 2017 at 5:09 am - Reply

    It is better because I’m not paying people to slaughter animals so that I can stuff my face, and the facts show that vegan=better for the environment lol I gave you the two easiest most relatable sources I have but I can go all out if you want, I just don’t like putting in an effort to have an honest discussion when you pull this whole “wah you hurt my feelings you’re ignorant blah blah blah” and don’t cite anything except yourself, literally. But ok…I’m the ignorant one here…that’s how I got to where I am in life 😉 I’m out ✌

  555. Eileen Lois Hittle February 1, 2017 at 5:20 am - Reply

    (Psst: it only counts if you’ve already read this and didn’t just start googling “why vegan diets are bad for you” just now)

  556. Daniel Mancini February 1, 2017 at 6:51 am - Reply

    haha sorry i must confess….i didnt actually read the article… i just wanted to prod you with a stick…metapjorically speaking ofcourse (nothing sexual).

    Not that theres anything wrong with prodding people with sticks ofcourse. If people enjoy prodding people with their sticks..good luck to em i say. Just make sure its legal and stay safe

  557. Daniel Mancini February 1, 2017 at 6:54 am - Reply

    PS. I miss both of u very much. And love u both very much (nothing sexual; well atleast from my part…i know you wouldnt…SHE wouldnt!)

  558. Chris Tardieu February 1, 2017 at 7:23 am - Reply

    I think this serves to justify the carnivorous desire. I have family who are vegetable farmers in Trinidad and they cater for the lose of crops to animals but the harvest is still profitable.

  559. Laura Richards February 1, 2017 at 8:09 am - Reply

    I don’t even know WHERE to begin with the flaws in this ‘article'(?!) he’s overlooked pretty much everything!

  560. Stella Elizabeth Serowka February 1, 2017 at 10:34 am - Reply

    I have to disagree! with this article!….Livestock feed is grown in massive amounts!…with the sole purpose to fatten animals ready for slaughter!!..and human consumption!…I cannot condone this!…I am totally against the consumption of any animal!..and am happy to say I am a vegetarian!…and always will be!…although I don’t feel anger towards the millions who enjoy meat!…its just my lifestyle choice!..I feel all animals should be given the right to live out there live’s humanly and in full!..But!…. I understand that the livelihood of farmers comes into play here!…Its a really difficult debate to have!….So all in all I feel the article in question has been poorly researched from the off!….but that is just my opinion!…..

  561. Dijana Yordanova February 1, 2017 at 12:19 pm - Reply

    The point is not to be perfect it’s to reduce suffering and harm. Why kill more when we don’t have to.

  562. Agna Krige February 1, 2017 at 2:43 pm - Reply

    Leo Tolstoy: “Where there are slaughter houses there will be wars.”

  563. Agna Krige February 1, 2017 at 3:09 pm - Reply

    Albert Einstein:- “Nothing will benefit human health and increase chances for survival of life on Earth as much as the evolution to a vegetarian diet.”

  564. Payton Dick February 1, 2017 at 5:02 pm - Reply

    Gimme a break.

  565. Christina Paige February 1, 2017 at 6:37 pm - Reply

    “””Humans eat less than 6 pounds of food per day, a cow eats over 110 pounds a day.

    Cut out the “middle man” and get your nutrients from plants, 20- 26 people could be fed on that same “feed” grown for cattle.

    The logic of this Argentinian fails.”””

  566. Christina Paige February 1, 2017 at 6:38 pm - Reply

    Yea no

  567. Rhianna Camsell February 2, 2017 at 5:10 pm - Reply

    Sorry I forgot to reply! Yeah I think it’s naive to expect to live your life without harming/affecting any animals whatsoever. But by being vegan definitely decreases that by a loooooot

  568. Irinej Papuga February 2, 2017 at 7:32 pm - Reply

    pač men je pošteno ubijat živali, sam meso je pa gadno!!!

  569. David Parnell February 15, 2017 at 8:40 am - Reply

    If we aren’t supposed to eat animals, then why are they made of meat???

  570. Bernard Yeo February 28, 2017 at 9:33 am - Reply

    We cannot be too extreme in this case and if we follow what the author’s reasoning, the fact that we are breathing in oxygen and exhaling carbon dioxide is already harming our environment. What we seek is a middle path and compromised way to coexist.

    Like many readers that have commented here, it makes no sense to waste our resources to fuel meat consumption and not forgetting that those animals feel the pains that we are feeling. Maybe the next step we can do is to reduce food wastes and our demand for food even for vegans.

  571. AmByrd Nguyen March 17, 2017 at 6:38 am - Reply

    Good for you

  572. Ashok RajGuru May 23, 2017 at 11:04 am - Reply

    This hypothesis would be good if you hunt wildlife for food. Sadly there is more acreage recovered from forests the create food for domesticated cattle than for human consumption. The feed conversion ratio for beef is around 5.
    If you want to eat meat, do so but don’t come up with a ridiculous argument. In a generation or two its the environmentalists, and not vegans who’ll legislate against meat.

  573. Hillary Vermont May 25, 2017 at 10:05 pm - Reply

    I hope this doesn’t stop anyone from becoming vegan or vegetarian. Grow your own gardens and barter with others that do to avoid this argument.

  574. Cade Foster May 25, 2017 at 11:54 pm - Reply

    That article’s author needs to reevaluate his findings. It is alright to ponder about a circle – where it starts and where it ends – then we go round and round coming to a conclusion – if there’s one – depending on your standing point of view though none of your views would be a conclusive one since the circle encircles the whole world and simply you cannot explain the whole world but you might challenge yours.

  575. ένας μποέμ May 25, 2017 at 11:56 pm - Reply

    And what we have to eat that does not causes animals’ death?

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